Thread: Please take part in the PostgreSQL ecosystem survey
We are announcing the start of PostgreSQL ecosystem survey. By filling out the following survey form, please let us knowwhat software you need in order to adopt PostgreSQL in wider range. The form comprises three questions: software/usage/industrycategory, a specific software, and a free comment on the interoperability issue of the software. Your request will encourage us to improve the interoperability of PostgreSQL to make more software available with PostgreSQL. Survey form https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Ueq4Z9MYJLv-gCp_UrPXENdSH6jXtqR0zz5F1W3Qqvo/viewform You can see the survey result in real time in the spreadsheets below. Survey response sheets https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sxd--agLVrFbn7M3YCqFTR812MrBExiyAM_4qVf9trk/pubhtml We really appreciate your cooperation. Thanks. Community discussion http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/471DBBEFA9CD4C26B83E7FAEDCB7482B@tunaPC BACKGROUND ============================================================ Thanks to the long and hard effort by the community, PostgreSQL has been evolving to be a really great software comparableto existing strong commercial products. According to the following article, open source databases are gainingmore popularity enough to influence the database market. Open source threatens to eat the database market http://www.infoworld.com/article/2916057/open-source-software/open-source-threatens-to-eat-the-database-market.html [Excerpt] "Though the proprietary RDBMS market grew at a sluggish 5.4 percent in 2014, the open source database market grew 31 percentto hit $562 million." "As Gartner highlights in a recent research report, open source databases now consume 25 percent of relational database usage." On the other hand, there is a gulf between the two top popular databases -- Oracle and MySQL -- and PostgreSQL. They arenearly five times more popular than PostgreSQL. DB-Engines Ranking http://db-engines.com/en/ranking Yes, I understand this ranking doesn't necessarily reflect the actual use, but I also don't think the ranking is far fromthe real popularity. PROBLEM: INSUFFICIENT AND/OR UNKNOWN INTEROPERABILITY ============================================================ What will be necessary for more users to use PostgreSQL? One challenge is interoperability, or ecosystem in other words,which is to increase the number of software which supports PostgreSQL. To take advantage of the trend of shift fromcommercial products to open source, PostgreSQL needs to interoperate with many software that are used together with thecommercial databases. The easily understandable target is Oracle, because it is anticipated that more users of Oracle will seek another databaseto avoid the expensive Oracle Standard Edition 2 and increasing maintenance costs. In addition, PostgreSQL has affinityfor Oracle. However, there is a problem. The number of software is very small that the users can know to interoperate with PostgreSQL. That is, when the users want to migrate from commercial databases to PostgreSQL, they can't get information onwhether they can continue to use their assets with PostgreSQL. Many applications might be interoperable through standardinterfaces like JDBC/ODBC, but the case is unknown. For example: * Only 24 open source projects are listed as interoperable. Open Source Projects Using PostgreSQL https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/OpenSource_Projects_Using_PostgreSQL * About 120 products are listed in the "Software Catalog" (excluding the ones like PostgreSQL extensions). But the numberwould drop down to about 100 if the members of the same product family are counted as one. http://www.postgresql.org/download/products/5-reporting-tools/ * Even EnterpriseDB has only 12 certified application vendors. http://www.enterprisedb.com/partner-programs/enterprisedb-certified-application-vendors * PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium lists only about30 related products (Japanese only). https://www.pgecons.org/postgresql-info/business_sw/ * MySQL touts more than 2,000 ISV/OEM/VARs. http://www.mysql.com/oem/ Besides, in practice, more development efforts will probably be necessary to make PostgreSQL more interoperable with manysoftware products. For example, one customer asked me whether Arcserve can be used to back up PostgreSQL databases,but unfortunately I had to answer no. ACTION: VISUALIZE AND IMPROVE INTEROPERABILITY ============================================================ At the steering committee of PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium (PGECons), I proposed starting the following activity. PGEConsis a Japanese non-profit organization to promote PostgreSQL for enterprise use. The members include NTT, SRA OSS,Inc. (Tatsuo Ishii runs), NEC, Hitachi, HP, Fujitsu (my company), etc. The committee concluded that we need to workin cooperation with the PostgreSQL community. * Attract and ask product/service vendors to support/use PostgreSQL. Provide technical assistance to those vendors as anorganization so that they can support PostgreSQL smoothly. If the vendors aren't proactive, we verify the interoperabilitywith their software by executing it. * Make a directory of software/services that can be used with PostgreSQL on the community web site (wiki.postgresql.org orwww.postgresql.org). Software/services vendors and PostgreSQL developers/users can edit this directory. This list notonly has the names of software and its vendors, but also other information such as the level of interoperability (certifiedby the vendor, or verified by the community/users) and remarks about configuration, tuning, and whatever usefulfor users. PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium (PGECons) https://www.pgecons.org/en Regards Takayuki Tsunakawa
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 05:57:31AM +0000, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: > We are announcing the start of PostgreSQL ecosystem survey. By > filling out the following survey form, please let us know what > software you need in order to adopt PostgreSQL in wider range. The > form comprises three questions: software/usage/industry category, a > specific software, and a free comment on the interoperability issue > of the software. Your request will encourage us to improve the > interoperability of PostgreSQL to make more software available with > PostgreSQL. > > Survey form > https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Ueq4Z9MYJLv-gCp_UrPXENdSH6jXtqR0zz5F1W3Qqvo/viewform Is there some way to arrange it so people can choose several categories at once and write up responses for each? > You can see the survey result in real time in the spreadsheets below. > > Survey response sheets > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sxd--agLVrFbn7M3YCqFTR812MrBExiyAM_4qVf9trk/pubhtml This is already neat stuff! Is there some time frame in which some other action will be taken? What resources are you connecting to this effort, and how can people help add to them? Cheers, David. -- David Fetter <david@fetter.org> http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter@gmail.com Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
We are announcing the start of PostgreSQL ecosystem survey. By filling out the following survey form, please let us know what software you need in order to adopt PostgreSQL in wider range. The form comprises three questions: software/usage/industry category, a specific software, and a free comment on the interoperability issue of the software. Your request will encourage us to improve the interoperability of PostgreSQL to make more software available with PostgreSQL.
Survey form
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Ueq4Z9MYJLv-gCp_UrPXENdSH6jXtqR0zz5F1W3Qqvo/viewform
You can see the survey result in real time in the spreadsheets below.
Survey response sheets
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sxd--agLVrFbn7M3YCqFTR812MrBExiyAM_4qVf9trk/pubhtml
We really appreciate your cooperation. Thanks.
Community discussion
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/471DBBEFA9CD4C26B83E7FAEDCB7482B@tunaPC
BACKGROUND
============================================================
Thanks to the long and hard effort by the community, PostgreSQL has been evolving to be a really great software comparable to existing strong commercial products. According to the following article, open source databases are gaining more popularity enough to influence the database market.
Open source threatens to eat the database market
http://www.infoworld.com/article/2916057/open-source-software/open-source-threatens-to-eat-the-database-market.html
[Excerpt]
"Though the proprietary RDBMS market grew at a sluggish 5.4 percent in 2014, the open source database market grew 31 percent to hit $562 million."
"As Gartner highlights in a recent research report, open source databases now consume 25 percent of relational database usage."
On the other hand, there is a gulf between the two top popular databases -- Oracle and MySQL -- and PostgreSQL. They are nearly five times more popular than PostgreSQL.
DB-Engines Ranking
http://db-engines.com/en/ranking
Yes, I understand this ranking doesn't necessarily reflect the actual use, but I also don't think the ranking is far from the real popularity.
PROBLEM: INSUFFICIENT AND/OR UNKNOWN INTEROPERABILITY
============================================================
What will be necessary for more users to use PostgreSQL? One challenge is interoperability, or ecosystem in other words, which is to increase the number of software which supports PostgreSQL. To take advantage of the trend of shift from commercial products to open source, PostgreSQL needs to interoperate with many software that are used together with the commercial databases.
The easily understandable target is Oracle, because it is anticipated that more users of Oracle will seek another database to avoid the expensive Oracle Standard Edition 2 and increasing maintenance costs. In addition, PostgreSQL has affinity for Oracle.
However, there is a problem. The number of software is very small that the users can know to interoperate with PostgreSQL. That is, when the users want to migrate from commercial databases to PostgreSQL, they can't get information on whether they can continue to use their assets with PostgreSQL. Many applications might be interoperable through standard interfaces like JDBC/ODBC, but the case is unknown. For example:
* Only 24 open source projects are listed as interoperable.
Open Source Projects Using PostgreSQL
https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/OpenSource_Projects_Using_PostgreSQL
* About 120 products are listed in the "Software Catalog" (excluding the ones like PostgreSQL extensions). But the number would drop down to about 100 if the members of the same product family are counted as one.
http://www.postgresql.org/download/products/5-reporting-tools/
* Even EnterpriseDB has only 12 certified application vendors.
http://www.enterprisedb.com/partner-programs/enterprisedb-certified-application-vendors
* PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium lists only about30 related products (Japanese only).
https://www.pgecons.org/postgresql-info/business_sw/
* MySQL touts more than 2,000 ISV/OEM/VARs.
http://www.mysql.com/oem/
Besides, in practice, more development efforts will probably be necessary to make PostgreSQL more interoperable with many software products. For example, one customer asked me whether Arcserve can be used to back up PostgreSQL databases, but unfortunately I had to answer no.
ACTION: VISUALIZE AND IMPROVE INTEROPERABILITY
============================================================
At the steering committee of PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium (PGECons), I proposed starting the following activity. PGECons is a Japanese non-profit organization to promote PostgreSQL for enterprise use. The members include NTT, SRA OSS, Inc. (Tatsuo Ishii runs), NEC, Hitachi, HP, Fujitsu (my company), etc. The committee concluded that we need to work in cooperation with the PostgreSQL community.
* Attract and ask product/service vendors to support/use PostgreSQL. Provide technical assistance to those vendors as an organization so that they can support PostgreSQL smoothly. If the vendors aren't proactive, we verify the interoperability with their software by executing it.
* Make a directory of software/services that can be used with PostgreSQL on the community web site (wiki.postgresql.org or www.postgresql.org). Software/services vendors and PostgreSQL developers/users can edit this directory. This list not only has the names of software and its vendors, but also other information such as the level of interoperability (certified by the vendor, or verified by the community/users) and remarks about configuration, tuning, and whatever useful for users.
PostgreSQL Enterprise Consortium (PGECons)
https://www.pgecons.org/en
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
--
Sent via pgsql-advocacy mailing list (pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org)
To make changes to your subscription:
http://www.postgresql.org/mailpref/pgsql-advocacy
101 Cecil Street, #11-11 Tong Eng Building, Singapore 069 533
T: +65 6438 3504 | M: +65 8110 0350 | www.ashnik.com
On 04/17/2016 10:57 PM, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: > On the other hand, there is a gulf between the two top popular databases -- Oracle and MySQL -- and PostgreSQL. They arenearly five times more popular than PostgreSQL. > > DB-Engines Ranking > http://db-engines.com/en/ranking > > Yes, I understand this ranking doesn't necessarily reflect the actual use, but I also don't think the ranking is far fromthe real popularity I've been over how DBEngines calculates their numbers. That's a correct assesment; the ranking is more-or-less correct, the numbers are not. Partly it's because a lot of the metrics they use focus on retrograde trends (i.e. what has been popular already for several years) and partly because of stupid things like not counting "Postgres" or "EnterpriseDB". Based on my own numbers, MySQL's popularity index (installed base and people) is still 2X to 3X ours. Difference is, PostgreSQL adoption is growing whereas MySQL is not. MariaDB could change that, though; they're picking up a lot of interest. -- -- Josh Berkus Red Hat OSAS (any opinions are my own)
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sameer Kumar
Can I share this with my customers and share on social media?
Of course, yes. I appreciate your interest.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org > > Survey form > > > https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Ueq4Z9MYJLv-gCp_UrPXENdSH6jXtqR0zz5F1 > > W3Qqvo/viewform > > Is there some way to arrange it so people can choose several categories > at once and write up responses for each? I'm sorry, no. At first, I considered selecting multiple items at once with checkboxes and adding multiple new entries witha comma-separated string. But I decided to not do so because mixing multiple categories/software in one response entrywould make it difficult or impossible to determine which comment is for what software, which software is in which category,and aggregate the count and comments of each software in the spreadsheet. > > Survey response sheets > > > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sxd--agLVrFbn7M3YCqFTR812MrBEx > > iyAM_4qVf9trk/pubhtml > > This is already neat stuff! Thanks, I'm relieved. As I'm blind and can't see the screen, I was a bit worried about many sheets on the screen. > Is there some time frame in which some other action will be taken? > > What resources are you connecting to this effort, and how can people help > add to them? Currently, there's no defined time frame, but my company and the PGECons will probably set the time frame some time. However,expanding the ecosystem should be an endless continual activity. I'll convince them so, and they should alreadyunderstand that without being convinced (I hope). About resources: I joined the PGECons steering committee this February and proposed establishing a WG to address interoperability. They said they've been also aware of the need to expand the ecosystem since the establishment of PGEConsa few years ago, but they don't know what to do. At least, the PGECons is not powerful enough to proceed the activityglobally. So, at the meeting, I was appointed to consult the community to discuss if and how to proceed. That isthe following mail: http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/471DBBEFA9CD4C26B83E7FAEDCB7482B@tunaPC If we can gain some level of momentum from the community and users (potential customers), we can start the WG officially. Until then, maybe we have to go below water as an unofficial hidden WG (that may become my lone fight). Anyway,I think we should do the work as publicly in the community as possible. I'm willing to do anything I can, includingdevelopment for interoperability e.g. implementing standards in ODBC/JDBC, assisting ISVs who try to port theirproducts to PostgreSQL, verifying popular ISV products, etc. About help: as mentioned in "CONSULTATION AND DISCUSSION" in the above mail, good ideas to proceed the activity would bemost appreciated in the first place. For example: * How/Where can we get the knowledge of expanding the software ecosystem? Is there any OSS project that we can learn from? How can we attract software vendors to support PostgreSQL? What words are convincing to appeal the increasing potentialof PostgreSQL as a good replacement for commercial databases? (The essential question: what does it mean to software vendors to support PostgreSQL? Can they increase their profit margin?) * How can we gain momentum for the activity? Can we involve globally influential companies like Dell, HPE, and Red Hat? * Do we need some kind of assistance from a foundation or establish a foundation? There should be many, many software to address, so the ecosystem activity has to be long-lasting. Plus, money and expertiseis necessary. Would we benefit if we join the Linux Foundation Collaborative Projects? Linux Foundation Collaborative Projects http://collabprojects.linuxfoundation.org/ In addition, the impending need for help is to how to publicize this survey. I posted it through pgsql-announce, pgsql-advocacy,and Planet PostgreSQL. I think I'll try to submit the same survey at DBA Stack Exchange, Software Recommendationsat Stack Exchange, and Hacker News. But Stack Exchange moderators seem to close the post if it's a poll (I'lltry anyway). Hacker News requires 200 karmas to post a poll, and I have no karma. Regards Takayuki Tsunakawa
> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org > Difference is, PostgreSQL adoption is growing whereas MySQL is not. That's good news. On the other hand, the problem/question is whether MySQL users will become inclined to migrate to aotherdatabase. I'm a bit pessimistic about it because those who like MySQL now will like MySQL/MariaDB in the future... > MariaDB could change that, though; they're picking up a lot of interest. And Amazon Aurora? BTW, AWS might develop something like Aurora based on PostgreSQL as a manager at AWS posted to pgsql-jobs a few days ago. Regards Takayuki Tsunakawa
On 2016-04-18 7:19 PM, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: >> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org >> Difference is, PostgreSQL adoption is growing whereas MySQL is not. > > That's good news. On the other hand, the problem/question is whether MySQL users will become inclined to migrate to aotherdatabase. I'm a bit pessimistic about it because those who like MySQL now will like MySQL/MariaDB in the future... On the other hand, there's the people who don't like MySQL and just use it because that's what they're already using or don't know better; education can help them be more informed and then its those who actually prefer MySQL that would stay there any longer than they have to. -- Darren Duncan
On 2016-04-19 03:04, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: > I think I'll try to submit the same survey at DBA > Stack Exchange, Software Recommendations at Stack Exchange, and Hacker > News. But Stack Exchange moderators seem to close the post if it's a > poll (I'll try anyway). Hacker News requires 200 karmas to post a > poll, and I have no karma. CitusDB (the PG prople) are very good with their Hacker News sunmissions, so very likely have high HN karma. If you ask them, they might be willing to post it on your behalf. :) Regards and best wishes, Justin Clift
Hi Takayuki, happy to help on posting to HN. Sent via mobile > On Apr 19, 2016, at 6:07 AM, Justin Clift <justin@postgresql.org> wrote: > >> On 2016-04-19 03:04, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: >> >> I think I'll try to submit the same survey at DBA >> Stack Exchange, Software Recommendations at Stack Exchange, and Hacker >> News. But Stack Exchange moderators seem to close the post if it's a >> poll (I'll try anyway). Hacker News requires 200 karmas to post a >> poll, and I have no karma. > > CitusDB (the PG prople) are very good with their Hacker News sunmissions, so very likely have high HN karma. > > If you ask them, they might be willing to post it on your behalf. :) > > Regards and best wishes, > > Justin Clift > > > -- > Sent via pgsql-advocacy mailing list (pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org) > To make changes to your subscription: > http://www.postgresql.org/mailpref/pgsql-advocacy
On 04/18/2016 07:19 PM, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: >> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org >> Difference is, PostgreSQL adoption is growing whereas MySQL is not. > > That's good news. On the other hand, the problem/question is whether MySQL users will become inclined to migrate to aotherdatabase. I'm a bit pessimistic about it because those who like MySQL now will like MySQL/MariaDB in the future... Migration is a zero-sum game. I'm more interested in new users who haven't already chosen a database. >> MariaDB could change that, though; they're picking up a lot of interest. > > And Amazon Aurora? So far, that's mostly replacing MySQL RDS. > > BTW, AWS might develop something like Aurora based on PostgreSQL as a manager at AWS posted to pgsql-jobs a few days ago. We'll see. The implementation of Aurora is based on MySQL's tabletype system, so they'd need something completely different for Postgres. -- -- Josh Berkus Red Hat OSAS (any opinions are my own)
2016/04/20 0:43 "Josh berkus" <josh@agliodbs.com>:
>
> On 04/18/2016 07:19 PM, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote:
> >> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org
> >> Difference is, PostgreSQL adoption is growing whereas MySQL is not.
> >
> > That's good news. On the other hand, the problem/question is whether MySQL users will become inclined to migrate to aother database. I'm a bit pessimistic about it because those who like MySQL now will like MySQL/MariaDB in the future...
>
> Migration is a zero-sum game. I'm more interested in new users who
> haven't already chosen a database.
+1.
And I'm also interested in developing some unique position/advantage of PostgreSQL in the database world, which means not just being "an alternative to XYZ".
I want to inspire more people to create something new by adopting PostgreSQL and open source. I believe that would be the differentiations.
Hi Umur, > From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org > Hi Takayuki, happy to help on posting to HN. Thank you so much! I'd like you to do so by all means. Could you tell me the URL of the post when you've posted? Justin, Thank you for your reference to CitusDB. Your help made this come true. Regards Takayuki Tsunakawa
From: satoshi.nagayasu@gmail.com [mailto:satoshi.nagayasu@gmail.com]
2016/04/20 0:43 "Josh berkus" <josh@agliodbs.com>:
> Migration is a zero-sum game. I'm more interested in new users who
> haven't already chosen a database.
+1.
And I'm also interested in developing some unique position/advantage of PostgreSQL in the database world, which means not just being "an alternative to XYZ".
I want to inspire more people to create something new by adopting PostgreSQL and open source. I believe that would be the differentiations.
Totally agreed. As "The Innovator's Dilemma" series say, there are two types of disruptive innovation: new-market disruption and low-end disruption. I believe PostgreSQL is expected on both sides.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hi Umur,
> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org
> Hi Takayuki, happy to help on posting to HN.
Thank you so much! I'd like you to do so by all means. Could you tell me the URL of the post when you've posted?
Justin,
Thank you for your reference to CitusDB. Your help made this come true.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
--
Sent via pgsql-advocacy mailing list (pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org)
To make changes to your subscription:
http://www.postgresql.org/mailpref/pgsql-advocacy
Hello, Sumedh,
From: Sumedh Pathak [mailto:sumedh@citusdata.com]
Sumedh from Citus here. I can post it as a poll, but that will only include the top-level choice of the Software Category. HN poll doesn't have an interface like Google form, and has no way to get the second-level information of the specific application in that category. That remaining information would have to be solicited via the comments. Is that OK? Or is there some change you'd like to make to the poll.
The text description would also need to be modified a bit due to this. The current text walks people through the structure of the form, so we'd have to simplify it. If the above works, I can modify it, and also happy for you to send me a modified poll and text for me to post.
Hmm, I'm afraid that will be likely to make it difficult to aggregate and analyze the result.
Let me confess that I haven't had a chance to see any HN poll. Does HN allow posting the URL of a poll on a different site? I thought I can submit an article with a brief introduction of the poll and "For details, please see here: <URL>". Then, I wanted to attach the following URL, which is what I posted through Planet PostgreSQL.
http://postgres-road.blogspot.jp/2016/04/join-survey-to-expand-postgresql.html
If not allowed as a poll system of HN, do you think we can submit a poll request as an "Ask" article?
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hello, Sumedh,
From: Sumedh Pathak [mailto:sumedh@citusdata.com]
Sumedh from Citus here. I can post it as a poll, but that will only include the top-level choice of the Software Category. HN poll doesn't have an interface like Google form, and has no way to get the second-level information of the specific application in that category. That remaining information would have to be solicited via the comments. Is that OK? Or is there some change you'd like to make to the poll.
The text description would also need to be modified a bit due to this. The current text walks people through the structure of the form, so we'd have to simplify it. If the above works, I can modify it, and also happy for you to send me a modified poll and text for me to post.
Hmm, I'm afraid that will be likely to make it difficult to aggregate and analyze the result.
Let me confess that I haven't had a chance to see any HN poll. Does HN allow posting the URL of a poll on a different site? I thought I can submit an article with a brief introduction of the poll and "For details, please see here: <URL>". Then, I wanted to attach the following URL, which is what I posted through Planet PostgreSQL.
http://postgres-road.blogspot.jp/2016/04/join-survey-to-expand-postgresql.html
If not allowed as a poll system of HN, do you think we can submit a poll request as an "Ask" article?
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
On 20 Apr 2016, at 22:56, Sumedh Pathak <sumedh@citusdata.com> wrote: > That can be doable, but its possible it may not get much traction. Typical AskHN doesn't link to an external site, andthe data is captured within the HN. Should I try that? The poll might get a bit more traction, but like you noted, theaggregation of the results would involve scanning through the text comments. I don't have a strong recommendation here,but probably the Poll might get a slightly better response. With the CitusDB articles submitted to Hacker News, they typically link to a informative piece. Do you feel submitting the initial announcement message - which already includes the survey link as it's first thing - would work out ok? http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1F561EFA@G01JPEXMBYT05 If not, probably use your best suggestion. You guys have more Hacker News experience + are getting good results. :) + Justin -- "My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was less competition there." - Indira Gandhi
Hello, Sumedh,
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
That can be doable, but its possible it may not get much traction. Typical AskHN doesn't link to an external site, and the data is captured within the HN. Should I try that? The poll might get a bit more traction, but like you noted, the aggregation of the results would involve scanning through the text comments. I don't have a strong recommendation here, but probably the Poll might get a slightly better response.
I see. That is, a poll can catch more people's eyes than Ask articles in HN, which is why submitting a poll requires 200 karmas, isn't it? What is more effective is to use the poll article, whatever its content is.
Then,
> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org
> [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Justin Clift
> With the CitusDB articles submitted to Hacker News, they typically link
> to a informative piece.
>
> Do you feel submitting the initial announcement message - which already
> includes the survey link as it's first thing - would work out ok?
>
>
> http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1
> F561EFA@G01JPEXMBYT05
I'd like to follow Justin's idea. Because gathering the survey result in one place (Google Form) not only streamlines the analysis, but also help to encourage more people to respond to the survey. People tend to gather where people already gather.
If the HN poll article requires at least one question in itself, could you create a dummy (but somehow useful) question and then invite visitors to the real poll? i.e. something like this:
--------------------------------------------------
Q: Please select items which you think are necessary for PostgreSQL to improve. You can select multiple choices.
1.Functionality
2.Performance
3.Quality
Interoperability with other software
If you chose interoperability, please let us know the details by responding the following poll.
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1
-------------------------------------------------
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
On 21 Apr 2016, at 01:51, Tsunakawa, Takayuki <tsunakawa.takay@jp.fujitsu.com> wrote: <snip> > 1.Functionality > 2.Performance > 3.Quality Out of curiosity, what would you consider "Scalability" (such as multi-master replication, and others) to fit under? It's kind of Functionality, but also kind of Performance. ;) + Justin -- "My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was less competition there." - Indira Gandhi
> From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org > [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Justin Clift > Out of curiosity, what would you consider "Scalability" (such as > multi-master replication, and others) to fit under? > > It's kind of Functionality, but also kind of Performance. ;) I think it's better to put scalability as a separate choice. Wikipedia says: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalability "A system whose performance improves after adding hardware, proportionally to the capacity added, is said to be a scalablesystem." But in that sense, other non-functional characteristics, like availability and manageability, can be the additional choices,too. Anyway, I just put an example of the dummy (guiding) question. Any interesting alternative dummy question/choices can beok. Regards Takayuki Tsunakawa
On 20 Apr 2016, at 22:56, Sumedh Pathak <sumedh@citusdata.com> wrote:
> That can be doable, but its possible it may not get much traction. Typical AskHN doesn't link to an external site, and the data is captured within the HN. Should I try that? The poll might get a bit more traction, but like you noted, the aggregation of the results would involve scanning through the text comments. I don't have a strong recommendation here, but probably the Poll might get a slightly better response.
With the CitusDB articles submitted to Hacker News, they typically link
to a informative piece.
Do you feel submitting the initial announcement message - which already
includes the survey link as it's first thing - would work out ok?
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1F561EFA@G01JPEXMBYT05
If not, probably use your best suggestion. You guys have more Hacker
News experience + are getting good results. :)
+ Justin
--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi
Hello, Sumech,
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
Sorry for the delay as I've been swamped with a few things. I think let's try submitting the link to the post, and see what kind of uptake it has. I'll co-ordinate a few up-votes, and also send you guys the link so you can use your HN accounts to upvote. I'll get to that on Monday if that works for you guys?
Thank you for your cooperation while you’re busy. Yes, please go ahead if it points to the original survey request mail as Justin suggested, which guides visitors to the Google Form.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hello, Sumech,
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
Sorry for the delay as I've been swamped with a few things. I think let's try submitting the link to the post, and see what kind of uptake it has. I'll co-ordinate a few up-votes, and also send you guys the link so you can use your HN accounts to upvote. I'll get to that on Monday if that works for you guys?
Thank you for your cooperation while you’re busy. Yes, please go ahead if it points to the original survey request mail as Justin suggested, which guides visitors to the Google Form.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hello, Sumedh and Justin,
From: Sumedh Pathak [mailto:sumedh@citusdata.com]
Submitted here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newest. With title: Join the survey to expand PostgreSQL ecosystem
Please search for it, and upvote so it garners more attention.
Thank you so much! I could never realize this without you.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hmmm, it kind of looks like this approach for Hacker News did't work. There's not much pick up of it from there. :( Oh well, at least now we know. ;) + Justin On 2016-04-26 02:52, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote: > Hello, Sumedh and Justin, > > From: Sumedh Pathak [mailto:sumedh@citusdata.com] > Submitted here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newest. With title: Join > the survey to expand PostgreSQL > ecosystem<http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1F561EFA@G01JPEXMBYT05> > > Please search for it, and upvote so it garners more attention. > > > Thank you so much! I could never realize this without you. > > Regards > Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hmmm, it kind of looks like this approach for Hacker News did't work. There's not
much pick up of it from there. :(
Oh well, at least now we know. ;)
+ Justin
On 2016-04-26 02:52, Tsunakawa, Takayuki wrote:Hello, Sumedh and Justin,
From: Sumedh Pathak [mailto:sumedh@citusdata.com]
Submitted here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newest. With title: Join
the survey to expand PostgreSQL
ecosystem<http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1F561EFA@G01JPEXMBYT05>
Please search for it, and upvote so it garners more attention.
Thank you so much! I could never realize this without you.
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
Yeah, it didn't really pick up. Ultimately, I think such types of requests are best asked in 'poll' form. The best option might be to restructure this so it can be submitted as a 'poll'.
I misunderstood that your post was a poll. Do you mean your previous post was an "Ask" article and so it didn't get attention as we were afraid?
Then, could you again take the trouble to re-post it as a "poll"? That is, posting one greeting (dummy) question and guide respondents to the original mailing list article like the following example. The below is just an example; any better guiding question would be OK. I'd like to avoid restructure and scatter the responses as much as possible...
--------------------------------------------------
Q: Please select items which you think are necessary for PostgreSQL to improve. You can select multiple choices.
1.Functionality
2.Performance
3.Quality
Interoperability with other software
4.Scalability
5.Availability
6.Manageability
If you chose interoperability, please let us know the details by responding the following poll.
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1
-------------------------------------------------
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hello, Sumedh,
We’re having the Golden Week holiday from April 29 to May 8 here in Japan, and I can’t read the mails to this address. Instead, I’m ccing this mail to my Gmail address, which I can use during the holiday. So please “reply to all” when replying.
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Tsunakawa, Takayuki
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 12:10 PM
To: Sumedh Pathak; Justin Clift
Cc: Umur Cubukcu; David Fetter; pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org
Subject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] Please take part in the PostgreSQL ecosystem survey
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
Yeah, it didn't really pick up. Ultimately, I think such types of requests are best asked in 'poll' form. The best option might be to restructure this so it can be submitted as a 'poll'.
I misunderstood that your post was a poll. Do you mean your previous post was an "Ask" article and so it didn't get attention as we were afraid?
Then, could you again take the trouble to re-post it as a "poll"? That is, posting one greeting (dummy) question and guide respondents to the original mailing list article like the following example. The below is just an example; any better guiding question would be OK. I'd like to avoid restructure and scatter the responses as much as possible...
--------------------------------------------------
Q: Please select items which you think are necessary for PostgreSQL to improve. You can select multiple choices.
1.Functionality
2.Performance
3.Quality
Interoperability with other software
4.Scalability
5.Availability
6.Manageability
If you chose interoperability, please let us know the details by responding the following poll.
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1
-------------------------------------------------
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa
Hello, Sumedh,
We’re having the Golden Week holiday from April 29 to May 8 here in Japan, and I can’t read the mails to this address. Instead, I’m ccing this mail to my Gmail address, which I can use during the holiday. So please “reply to all” when replying.
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Tsunakawa, Takayuki
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 12:10 PM
To: Sumedh Pathak; Justin Clift
Cc: Umur Cubukcu; David Fetter; pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org
Subject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] Please take part in the PostgreSQL ecosystem survey
From: pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org [mailto:pgsql-advocacy-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Sumedh Pathak
Yeah, it didn't really pick up. Ultimately, I think such types of requests are best asked in 'poll' form. The best option might be to restructure this so it can be submitted as a 'poll'.
I misunderstood that your post was a poll. Do you mean your previous post was an "Ask" article and so it didn't get attention as we were afraid?
Then, could you again take the trouble to re-post it as a "poll"? That is, posting one greeting (dummy) question and guide respondents to the original mailing list article like the following example. The below is just an example; any better guiding question would be OK. I'd like to avoid restructure and scatter the responses as much as possible...
--------------------------------------------------
Q: Please select items which you think are necessary for PostgreSQL to improve. You can select multiple choices.
1.Functionality
2.Performance
3.Quality
Interoperability with other software
4.Scalability
5.Availability
6.Manageability
If you chose interoperability, please let us know the details by responding the following poll.
http://www.postgresql.org/message-id/0A3221C70F24FB45833433255569204D1
-------------------------------------------------
Regards
Takayuki Tsunakawa