Thread: font size
Folks, The web site looks fantastic, but I can't read anything that's on it, as the font size appears to be ~4point. I'm using Firefox (Linux & OSX) if that matters. Help! Cheers, D -- David Fetter david@fetter.org http://fetter.org/ phone: +1 510 893 6100 mobile: +1 415 235 3778 Remember to vote!
On Jan 12, 2005, at 17:39, David Fetter wrote: > On Wed, Jan 12, 2005 at 05:36:16PM +0900, Michael Glaesmann wrote: >> Heya David, >> >> On Jan 12, 2005, at 14:23, David Fetter wrote: >> >>> The web site looks fantastic, but I can't read anything that's on it, >>> as the font size appears to be ~4point. I'm using Firefox (Linux & >>> OSX) if that matters. Help! >> >> Have you tried clicking Text Size: Large on the main page? (It's up on >> the top to the far left of the Search field). > > That's nice. Can it be made the default? :) There *are* people who like the smaller size :) Once it's clicked, it stays. Michael Glaesemann grzm myrealbox com
On Jan 12, 2005, at 17:45, David Fetter wrote: > On Wed, Jan 12, 2005 at 05:41:37PM +0900, Michael Glaesmann wrote: >> >> There *are* people who like the smaller size :) Once it's clicked, >> it stays. > > Hrm. I don't suppose it would help me to mention the ADA, given that > this is an international web site. The American Disabilities Act (and similar legislation), afaik (and I won't claim to be an expert) is satisfied (in part) if the site is capable of being viewed at other point sizes. Nothing prevents browser resizing, and having a size option is a bonus. I think it boils down to individual preference. If you're refering to the American Dental Association, I'm not quite sure what that has to do with it. :) Michael Glaesemann grzm myrealbox com
On Jan 12, 2005, at 18:04, David Fetter wrote: > On Wed, Jan 12, 2005 at 05:59:44PM +0900, Michael Glaesmann wrote: >> >> On Jan 12, 2005, at 17:45, David Fetter wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2005 at 05:41:37PM +0900, Michael Glaesmann wrote: >>>> >>>> There *are* people who like the smaller size :) Once it's clicked, >>>> it stays. >>> >>> Hrm. I don't suppose it would help me to mention the ADA, given >>> that this is an international web site. >> >> The American Disabilities Act (and similar legislation), afaik (and >> I won't claim to be an expert) is satisfied (in part) if the site is >> capable of being viewed at other point sizes. Nothing prevents >> browser resizing, and having a size option is a bonus. I think it >> boils down to individual preference. > > Oh, well. some of us old fogies can't even read "Larger" button when > it's small. That's a good point. Larger should be Larger, eh? I've also thought the text at the top is quite light in color. (The gray overall could be a little darker. There are quite a few shades of gray between the current hue and black.) It might not be a bad idea to have a couple more stylesheet options. (I'm assuming the current smaller/larger text size is managed via a stylesheet switcher.) Joshua Drake just posted an alternative style sheet for the docs. Michael Glaesemann grzm myrealbox com
> -----Original Message----- > From: pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org > [mailto:pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Michael > Glaesemann > Sent: 12 January 2005 09:00 > To: David Fetter > Cc: PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > The American Disabilities Act (and similar legislation), afaik (and I > won't claim to be an expert) is satisfied (in part) if the site is > capable of being viewed at other point sizes. Nothing > prevents browser > resizing, and having a size option is a bonus. I think it > boils down to > individual preference. Well the best guide is probably: http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10/ I haven't double checked it, but I don't think the font size is actually an issue anyway, as long as the user is not prevented from altering the size using the options on their browser. From recollection, there's probably not much (if anything) on the new site that would prevent it getting at least an A rating (the minimum expected in Rightpondia), particularly as I saw Omar added alt tags for all the layout related graphics the other day. /D
Michael Glaesemann wrote: > There *are* people who like the smaller size :) Once it's clicked, it > stays. Time for a survey on the front page: I would like the text on this web site to be ( ) smaller ( ) the same ( ) larger -- Peter Eisentraut http://developer.postgresql.org/~petere/
> -----Original Message----- > From: pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org > [mailto:pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Peter Eisentraut > Sent: 12 January 2005 15:41 > To: Michael Glaesemann > Cc: David Fetter; PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > Michael Glaesemann wrote: > > There *are* people who like the smaller size :) Once it's > clicked, it > > stays. > > Time for a survey on the front page: > > I would like the text on this web site to be > > ( ) smaller > ( ) the same > ( ) larger Err, surveys? We don't get those any more except hidden away in the community area. I got out-voted on that one iirc. /D
> -----Original Message----- > From: pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org > [mailto:pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Dave Page > Sent: 12 January 2005 15:47 > To: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann > Cc: David Fetter; PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > > I would like the text on this web site to be > > > > ( ) smaller > > ( ) the same > > ( ) larger > > Err, surveys? We don't get those any more except hidden away in the > community area. I got out-voted on that one iirc. Survey changed btw. It can be found at http://wwwmaster.postgresql.org/community until it hits the mirrors. /D
On Wednesday 12 January 2005 10:51, Dave Page wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org > > [mailto:pgsql-www-owner@postgresql.org] On Behalf Of Dave Page > > Sent: 12 January 2005 15:47 > > To: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann > > Cc: David Fetter; PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > > > > I would like the text on this web site to be > > > > > > ( ) smaller > > > ( ) the same > > > ( ) larger > > > > Err, surveys? We don't get those any more except hidden away in the > > community area. I got out-voted on that one iirc. > IIRC you didn't get out voted, just no one implemented the alternative scheme, which was to alternate between quotes and survey on the main page (speaking of which isn't it time to update the quote on the main page? We should try to do it monthly at least.) > Survey changed btw. It can be found at > http://wwwmaster.postgresql.org/community until it hits the mirrors. > The beauty of this survey is that the results can be skewed. For example, how many people submitting "As it is" have already hit the "larger" style link at the top of the page days ago and think that is what they are voting for. -- Robert Treat Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
> -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Treat [mailto:xzilla@users.sourceforge.net] > Sent: 14 January 2005 03:59 > To: Dave Page > Cc: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann; David Fetter; > PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > The beauty of this survey is that the results can be skewed. > For example, how > many people submitting "As it is" have already hit the > "larger" style link at > the top of the page days ago and think that is what they are > voting for. True. Still, the response isn't exactly overwhelming - 66 votes so far :-( /D
On Friday 14 January 2005 03:21, Dave Page wrote:
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Robert Treat [mailto:xzilla@users.sourceforge.net]
> > Sent: 14 January 2005 03:59
> > To: Dave Page
> > Cc: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann; David Fetter;
> > PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List
> > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size
> >
> > The beauty of this survey is that the results can be skewed.
> > For example, how
> > many people submitting "As it is" have already hit the
> > "larger" style link at
> > the top of the page days ago and think that is what they are
> > voting for.
>
> True. Still, the response isn't exactly overwhelming - 66 votes so far
>
Well this goes back to your statement on the survey being hidden rather than
being on the front page. Or maybe the font size is still so small people
can't actually see the survey in thier browsers ;-)
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
> -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Treat [mailto:xzilla@users.sourceforge.net] > Sent: 14 January 2005 14:38 > To: Dave Page > Cc: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann; David Fetter; > PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > Well this goes back to your statement on the survey being > hidden rather than > being on the front page. Or maybe the font size is still so > small people > can't actually see the survey in thier browsers ;-) The could well be the case. OK, seeing as I have yet to hear from the very people I was waiting to hear from, I propose: 1) We replace the user quote on the front page with the survey. 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more prominent color than the current grey. 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current small and large sizes. Opinions/yays or nays please - and just so there is no confusion, majority rules!! Regards, Dave.
On Friday 14 January 2005 09:54, Dave Page wrote:
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Robert Treat [mailto:xzilla@users.sourceforge.net]
> > Sent: 14 January 2005 14:38
> > To: Dave Page
> > Cc: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann; David Fetter;
> > PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List
> > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size
> >
> > Well this goes back to your statement on the survey being
> > hidden rather than
> > being on the front page. Or maybe the font size is still so
> > small people
> > can't actually see the survey in thier browsers ;-)
>
> The could well be the case. OK, seeing as I have yet to hear from the
> very people I was waiting to hear from, I propose:
>
> 1) We replace the user quote on the front page with the survey.
>
With the intent being to rotate quotes and surveys, +1 from me.
> 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more
> prominent color than the current grey.
>
+1
> 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase
> the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current
> small and large sizes.
>
imho the large size should be 100% size, as users intend it to be, with
possibly smaller or larger text links made available if people like those.
barring that I'll give a +1 to the above, since it really should be
increased.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005, Dave Page wrote: > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Robert Treat [mailto:xzilla@users.sourceforge.net] > > Sent: 14 January 2005 14:38 > > To: Dave Page > > Cc: Peter Eisentraut; Michael Glaesemann; David Fetter; > > PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > > > Well this goes back to your statement on the survey being > > hidden rather than > > being on the front page. Or maybe the font size is still so > > small people > > can't actually see the survey in thier browsers ;-) > > The could well be the case. OK, seeing as I have yet to hear from the > very people I was waiting to hear from, I propose: > > 1) We replace the user quote on the front page with the survey. Argh. Please, can we not. I just don't see the point of the survey. > > 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more > prominent color than the current grey. Sure. I go for darker colour. > > 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase > the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current > small and large sizes. I think we leave the font as it is. I run at a high screen resolution. The font *would* be a problem if we didn't have the text size toggle on top of all pages. More over, since it remembers your preference, there shouldn't be a problem. The only change I can think of is a toggle to reduce the size. I think Michael requested this. Gavin
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 > Opinions/yays or nays please - and just so there is no confusion, > majority rules!! > 1) We replace the user quote on the front page with the survey. I prefer the user quote. > 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more > prominent color than the current grey. Excellent. > 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase > the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current > small and large sizes. I'd like to see us not monkey with the font size at all, so my vote would be to increase it to 100% for the default, and have an option to go to 75% for those who prefer a more squinty site. :) - -- Greg Sabino Mullane greg@turnstep.com PGP Key: 0x14964AC8 200501142102 http://biglumber.com/x/web?pk=2529DF6AB8F79407E94445B4BC9B906714964AC8 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iD8DBQFB6HnfvJuQZxSWSsgRAhqvAJ43pheUbaZ9TOkjCbrtoN0lzoiF2ACgrZeW RWnyZIubFQvJEkvoxDCXgxM= =BzBZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Greg Sabino Mullane wrote: > > 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase > > the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current > > small and large sizes. > > I'd like to see us not monkey with the font size at all, so my vote > would be to increase it to 100% for the default, and have an option > to go to 75% for those who prefer a more squinty site. :) Agreed. Don't you usually reduce the size when you want some text to be less prominent. Reducing it all doesn't seem to make sense. If we want we could have at the top: <Small> <Normal> <Large> with normal at 100%. -- Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us pgman@candle.pha.pa.us | (610) 359-1001 + If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road + Christ can be your backup. | Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073
Gavin Sherry wrote: > I think we leave the font as it is. I run at a high screen > resolution. The font *would* be a problem if we didn't have the text > size toggle on top of all pages. The toggle is not on top of all pages, for example the documentation pages. And more importantly, it doesn't work for everyone. -- Peter Eisentraut http://developer.postgresql.org/~petere/
Peter Eisentraut <peter_e@gmx.net> writes:
> Gavin Sherry wrote:
>> I think we leave the font as it is. I run at a high screen
>> resolution. The font *would* be a problem if we didn't have the text
>> size toggle on top of all pages.
> The toggle is not on top of all pages, for example the documentation
> pages. And more importantly, it doesn't work for everyone.
The really fundamental question is: what the heck are we doing
overriding the viewer's preference for font size in the first place?
I don't claim to be a web site designer, but this sure goes against
what I understand to be good practice.
regards, tom lane
On Jan 15, 2005, at 8:50, Gavin Sherry wrote: > On Fri, 14 Jan 2005, Dave Page wrote: > >> >> >> 1) We replace the user quote on the front page with the survey. > > Argh. Please, can we not. I just don't see the point of the survey. I'm in agreement here. I don't know how useful the survey is. >> 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more >> prominent color than the current grey. > > Sure. I go for darker colour. +1 >> 3) After a couple of weeks or so, if the users request it we increase >> the default font size a little. I think somewhere between the current >> small and large sizes. > > I think we leave the font as it is. I run at a high screen resolution. > The > font *would* be a problem if we didn't have the text size toggle on > top of > all pages. More over, since it remembers your preference, there > shouldn't > be a problem. The only change I can think of is a toggle to reduce the > size. I think Michael requested this. Personally I don't think we need a smaller size. I like it how it is, and personally think the larger size doesn't look as professional. The font size switcher is in fact just a css switcher. It could potentially be used to choose between a lot more options: color, size, layout--anything that is controlled through css. I think making the gray darker would also call attention to the fact that the font size option is there. Perhaps three sizes could be made available, Small (current normal), medium (current Larger), and Large (100%). Michael Glaesemann grzm myrealbox com
> -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Eisentraut [mailto:peter_e@gmx.net] > Sent: 15 January 2005 09:32 > To: Gavin Sherry > Cc: Dave Page; Robert Treat; Michael Glaesemann; David > Fetter; PostgreSQL WWW Mailing List > Subject: Re: [pgsql-www] font size > > Gavin Sherry wrote: > > I think we leave the font as it is. I run at a high screen > > resolution. The font *would* be a problem if we didn't have the text > > size toggle on top of all pages. > > The toggle is not on top of all pages, for example the documentation > pages. And more importantly, it doesn't work for everyone. It is on the doc pages, right under the search box. Regards, Dave.
Michael Glaesemann wrote: >>> 2) The sub headings (H2 iirc) are made either darker, or a more >>> prominent color than the current grey. >> >> Sure. I go for darker colour. > > +1 The grey has been darkened. Should show on postgresql.org in a few hours. Emily