Thread: Commission clears Oracle's proposed acquisition of Sun Microsystems
".... The Commission's investigation showed that another open source database, PostgreSQL, is considered by many database users to be a credible alternative to MySQL and could be expected to replace to some extent the competitive force currently exerted by MySQL on the database market ....." Ref:http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/10/40&format=HTML&aged=0&language=EN&guiLanguage=en -- Rafael Martinez, <r.m.guerrero@usit.uio.no> Center for Information Technology Services University of Oslo, Norway PGP Public Key: http://folk.uio.no/rafael/
Rafael Martinez a écrit : > ".... The Commission's investigation showed that another open source > database, PostgreSQL, is considered by many database users to be a > credible alternative to MySQL and could be expected to replace to some > extent the competitive force currently exerted by MySQL on the database > market ....." > > Ref:http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/10/40&format=HTML&aged=0&language=EN&guiLanguage=en > Sounds like a syllogism to me : (A) There should be alternatives to Oracle and (B) PostgreSQL is a credible alternative to MySQL So (C) Oracle can buy MySQL
On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 2:37 PM, damien clochard <damien@dalibo.info> wrote: > Sounds like a syllogism to me : > > (A) There should be alternatives to Oracle > and (B) PostgreSQL is a credible alternative to MySQL > So (C) Oracle can buy MySQL Sounds like free advertising to me. -- Regards, Richard Broersma Jr. Visit the Los Angeles PostgreSQL Users Group (LAPUG) http://pugs.postgresql.org/lapug
On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 03:01:27PM -0800, Richard Broersma wrote: > On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 2:37 PM, damien clochard <damien@dalibo.info> wrote: > > Sounds like a syllogism to me : > > > > (A) There should be alternatives to Oracle and (B) PostgreSQL is > > a credible alternative to MySQL So (C) Oracle can buy MySQL > > Sounds like free advertising to me. Sure does. Now as to whether MySQL would be a "credible alternative" to PostgreSQL...well, only one person I've talked with who's ever worked there has said anything of the kind, and he was in sales, and it was 2002. Cheers, David. -- David Fetter <david@fetter.org> http://fetter.org/ Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david.fetter@gmail.com iCal: webcal://www.tripit.com/feed/ical/people/david74/tripit.ics Remember to vote! Consider donating to Postgres: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
Re: Commission clears Oracle's proposed acquisition of Sun Microsystems
From
Gabriele Bartolini
Date:
Ciao, David Fetter ha scritto: > Sure does. > However, there are not many people who think like the EC about PostgreSQL. Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has only pointed out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a valid alternative. Here is the original message (http://www.newsfactor.com/story.xhtml?story_id=112003NN5V4G&full_skip=1): "The EC's reasoning has to be reviewed when all the details of the decision are known, but based on the EC's press release, it seems to be a decision based on wishful thinking for the future more so than anything else," Mueller said. "PostgreSQL has been around for decades without having had its mainstream breakthrough, so the EC can't seriously claim that PostgreSQL could replace MySQL as a competitive force." If PostgreSQL is based on "wishful thinking for the future", I don't know what to think about MariaDB then. I am about to comment that article in Italy - as it gives an unobjective representation of PostgreSQL -, but I'd love to know if the PostgreSQL community is thinking of a public announcement about this speculation on PostgreSQL, following MySQL acquisition of Oracle. Maybe we should wait next Wednesday when we will know more about the future of Oracle MySQL (at least officially). Any comments? Ciao, Gabriele -- Gabriele Bartolini - 2ndQuadrant Italia PostgreSQL Training, Services and Support gabriele.bartolini@2ndQuadrant.it | www.2ndQuadrant.it
Gabriele Bartolini wrote: > Ciao, > > David Fetter ha scritto: > > Sure does. > > > However, there are not many people who think like the EC about > PostgreSQL. Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has > only pointed out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a > valid alternative. Here is the original message > (http://www.newsfactor.com/story.xhtml?story_id=112003NN5V4G&full_skip=1): > > "The EC's reasoning has to be reviewed when all the details of the > decision are known, but based on the EC's press release, it seems to be > a decision based on wishful thinking for the future more so than > anything else," Mueller said. "PostgreSQL has been around for decades > without having had its mainstream breakthrough, so the EC can't > seriously claim that PostgreSQL could replace MySQL as a competitive > force." > > If PostgreSQL is based on "wishful thinking for the future", I don't > know what to think about MariaDB then. > > I am about to comment that article in Italy - as it gives an unobjective > representation of PostgreSQL -, but I'd love to know if the PostgreSQL > community is thinking of a public announcement about this speculation on > PostgreSQL, following MySQL acquisition of Oracle. Maybe we should wait > next Wednesday when we will know more about the future of Oracle MySQL > (at least officially). Wow, Florian Muller's comments seem so out of the mainstream that I think replying to them in a public announcement would just lend them legitimacy. -- Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. +
On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote: > Wow, Florian Muller's comments seem so out of the mainstream that I > think replying to them in a public announcement would just lend them > legitimacy. Well he's right in a way. We'd have to implement all manner of gotchas, bugs and just plain weirdness in our code before we could claim to replace MySQL. :-p -- Dave Page EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
Gabriele Bartolini wrote: > Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has only pointed > out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a valid > alternative. Before I got to his comments, I saw the helpful disclaimer they added of "former MySQL shareholder", and knew there wasn't going to be a unbiased comment coming before I even read it. -- Greg Smith 2ndQuadrant Baltimore, MD PostgreSQL Training, Services and Support greg@2ndQuadrant.com www.2ndQuadrant.com
Re: Commission clears Oracle's proposed acquisition of Sun Microsystems
From
Leif Biberg Kristensen
Date:
On Friday 22. January 2010 14.49.47 Dave Page wrote: > On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Bruce Momjian <bruce@momjian.us> wrote: > > > Wow, Florian Muller's comments seem so out of the mainstream that I > > think replying to them in a public announcement would just lend them > > legitimacy. > > Well he's right in a way. We'd have to implement all manner of > gotchas, bugs and just plain weirdness in our code before we could > claim to replace MySQL. > > :-p There's one thing that PostgreSQL still is missing: Transparent upgrades, without the dump / upgrade / reload routine. That's just too awkward in a hosted environment. regards, -- Leif Biberg Kristensen http://solumslekt.org/
Leif Biberg Kristensen wrote: > There's one thing that PostgreSQL still is missing: Transparent upgrades, > without the dump / upgrade / reload routine. That's just too awkward in a > hosted environment. > There's no good solution for 8.2 or below, but pg_migrator does this just fine for any simple case, starting with PostgreSQL 8.3: http://pgfoundry.org/projects/pg-migrator It can be tricky to get the program installed and working properly if you're not familiar with building software yourself from source. And there are limitations related to advanced features like large objects, or upgrades of user-defined types into 8.4. But those aren't things I'd expect your typical install in a hosting environment to have used in the first place. Now, actually getting pg_migrator packaged up so that it's easy for people in a hosted environment to use, that's an unsolved problem as far as I know. But the idea that you need dump/upgrade/reload isn't really true anymore, once you cross the line to running at least 8.3. -- Greg Smith 2ndQuadrant Baltimore, MD PostgreSQL Training, Services and Support greg@2ndQuadrant.com www.2ndQuadrant.com
David Fetter escribió: > > On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 2:37 PM, damien clochard <damien@dalibo.info> wrote: > > > Sounds like a syllogism to me : > > > > > > (A) There should be alternatives to Oracle and (B) PostgreSQL is > > > a credible alternative to MySQL So (C) Oracle can buy MySQL > Now as to whether MySQL would be a "credible alternative" to > PostgreSQL...well, only one person I've talked with who's ever worked > there has said anything of the kind, and he was in sales, and it was > 2002. I think "being a credible alternative" is not commutative, so I see no problem here. -- Alvaro Herrera http://www.CommandPrompt.com/ PostgreSQL Replication, Consulting, Custom Development, 24x7 support
Gabriele
You should be aware that he is wedded to Adobe and other mainstream commercial products and I believe he has a book coming out on Flex.
I think it's worth mentioning that Florian took to our once:radix technology (which, of course, is built on PostgreSQL) with a big stick too. Oh, he was polite about it but nevertheless approached it with a completely closed mind. The fact that organisations such as Bankers Trust use and praise our software is of no interest to him.
Of course PostgreSQL has a far greater success story to tell but that won’t stop him from following his biases. He is building his reputation as a critic.
Ask any restaurateur about critics. They get no mileage out of being fair minded. And they build their reputations by pushing their own particular barrow. The best thing to do is to ignore them. They thrive on controversy.
I found his attitude to be completely intransigent to anything outside of his world view. You won't shift his attitude so it is not worth giving credence to his comments.
On 22/1/10 8:29 PM, "Gabriele Bartolini" <gabriele.bartolini@2ndQuadrant.it> wrote:
> However, there are not many people who think like the EC about
> PostgreSQL. Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has
> only pointed out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a
> valid alternative.
Regards
Rob Napier
You should be aware that he is wedded to Adobe and other mainstream commercial products and I believe he has a book coming out on Flex.
I think it's worth mentioning that Florian took to our once:radix technology (which, of course, is built on PostgreSQL) with a big stick too. Oh, he was polite about it but nevertheless approached it with a completely closed mind. The fact that organisations such as Bankers Trust use and praise our software is of no interest to him.
Of course PostgreSQL has a far greater success story to tell but that won’t stop him from following his biases. He is building his reputation as a critic.
Ask any restaurateur about critics. They get no mileage out of being fair minded. And they build their reputations by pushing their own particular barrow. The best thing to do is to ignore them. They thrive on controversy.
I found his attitude to be completely intransigent to anything outside of his world view. You won't shift his attitude so it is not worth giving credence to his comments.
On 22/1/10 8:29 PM, "Gabriele Bartolini" <gabriele.bartolini@2ndQuadrant.it> wrote:
> However, there are not many people who think like the EC about
> PostgreSQL. Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has
> only pointed out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a
> valid alternative.
Regards
Rob Napier
>> However, there are not many people who think like the EC about >> PostgreSQL. Unfortunately, in Italy, the major IT online magazine has >> only pointed out that Florian Muller thinks that PostgreSQL can't be a >> valid alternative. Well, Florian has a point in that there currently isn't a worldwide tier-1 support company backing PostgreSQL. So regardless of technical merit, it's not the same kind of competitive force which MySQL was, *yet*. It's also a bit of bizarre reasoning that having one successful open source SQL database is enough for the market. *however*, it was my opinion that Sun had already effectively destroyed the MySQL commercial business, and that regardless of who bought Sun, MySQL as a centralized commercial entity would be finished. For that matter, before the Sun acquisition, MySQL **as a commercial product** was a smaller database business than Filemaker, and I don't imagine the EC would hold anti-trust hearings over acquiring that. --Josh Berkus