Thread: Is Postgres comparable to MSSQL
Hello,
I am a network/security guy not a dba. A friend is a developer/dba type. We
often debate whether open source software is viable for the enterprise or our
50 person company. He doesn't know much about Linux or opensource yet is
very dogmatic.
One argument he makes repeatedly is that there is no database that is
enterprise worthy for a cost even comparable to MSSQL. He says that
Postegres is not even in the same class as MSSQL, DB2, Oracle. He often
points to the db benchmarks which of course, pg is not involved in because
you have to pay be involved.
I thought that pg was on par with these, that is to say that in all but the
most demanding applications, you would never see the difference between good
implementations of each one.
Please let me know if I am wrong. I would love to have some serious examples
to show that opensource is not a "toy" and can be used effectively in the
enterprise with all of the regular enterprise features. I am sure everyone
is tired of comparison questions, but comparisons would be ok to.
He probably still won't admit to it, but at least we will both know. :)
--
Andy Hester
Network Engineer
Galactic LTD
Andy Hester wrote: > Please let me know if I am wrong. I would love to have some serious examples > to show that opensource is not a "toy" and can be used effectively in the > enterprise with all of the regular enterprise features. I am sure everyone > is tired of comparison questions, but comparisons would be ok to. > > He probably still won't admit to it, but at least we will both know. :) Well, start here - there are links to case studies, awards, quotes from happy corporate users etc: http://www.postgresql.org/about/ If you'd like more touch/taste evidence from the technical/engineering side then search the mailing list archives and see the sort of questions people are asking about configuring 14-disk arrays and managing 100GB tables. Of course, at the end of the day PG is free and your friend can test it for himself. That's the only way to settle these discussions - actually get some evidence. -- Richard Huxton Archonet Ltd
Andy, Well, to answer the question in your subject line: "no, it's not. MSSQL sucks for everything but OLAP. It's not even in the same league as PostgreSQL. Besides, you can *only* run it on Windows." > I am a network/security guy not a dba. A friend is a developer/dba type. We > often debate whether open source software is viable for the enterprise or our > 50 person company. He doesn't know much about Linux or opensource yet is > very dogmatic. > > One argument he makes repeatedly is that there is no database that is > enterprise worthy for a cost even comparable to MSSQL. He says that > Postegres is not even in the same class as MSSQL, DB2, Oracle. He often > points to the db benchmarks which of course, pg is not involved in because > you have to pay be involved. > > I thought that pg was on par with these, that is to say that in all but the > most demanding applications, you would never see the difference between good > implementations of each one. Well, you're not going to win this argument. Often DBAs become very attached to the databases they're familiar with; for your coworker, Postgres will always be inferior to MSSQL because it's not as good at being MSSQL as MSSQL is. His evaluation criteria are similar to asking: "Which actor is the better Keanu Reeves? Keanu, or Peter O'Toole?" That being said, here's a short list of major PostgreSQL users: National Weather Service Cisco Ameritrade Fujitsu SRA Inc. Sony Yamaha US Army Library of Congress Afilias (.ORG and .INFO domains) Sun Microsystems Federal Gov't of Venezuala Sao Paolo Muni NTT Data ... so I think PostgreSQL should be "good enough" for your 50-person company. One interesting example is TravelPost.com, which is using PostGIS with ASP.NET, and finds the performance of Postgres, even with .NET, to be superior to SQL Server. --Josh
On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 09:56:12AM -0700, Josh Berkus wrote: > That being said, here's a short list of major PostgreSQL users: > > National Weather Service > Cisco > Ameritrade > Fujitsu > SRA Inc. > Sony > Yamaha > US Army > Library of Congress > Afilias (.ORG and .INFO domains) > Sun Microsystems > Federal Gov't of Venezuala > Sao Paolo Muni > NTT Data > > ... so I think PostgreSQL should be "good enough" for your 50-person > company. One interesting example is TravelPost.com, which is using > PostGIS with ASP.NET, and finds the performance of Postgres, even with > .NET, to be superior to SQL Server. Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? -- Jim C. Nasby, Sr. Engineering Consultant jnasby@pervasive.com Pervasive Software http://pervasive.com work: 512-231-6117 vcard: http://jim.nasby.net/pervasive.vcf cell: 512-569-9461
> One interesting example is TravelPost.com, which is using PostGIS with > ASP.NET, and finds the performance of Postgres, even with .NET, to be > superior to SQL Server. Do you think TravelPost would mind if others knew about that - i.e. is it OK to forward that msg to people where I work? --Josh
Josh, > > One interesting example is TravelPost.com, which is using PostGIS with > > ASP.NET, and finds the performance of Postgres, even with .NET, to be > > superior to SQL Server. > > Do you think TravelPost would mind if others knew about that - i.e. is > it OK to forward that msg to people where I work? Given that they've been quoted on our web site? No problem. As long as you include their URL so they get some traffic ... -- --Josh Josh Berkus Aglio Database Solutions San Francisco
Jim, > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done: 1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL users. 2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up. 3) Draft an xhtml page with the list. --Josh -- __Aglio Database Solutions_______________ Josh Berkus Consultant josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387 2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA
Hi One of the biggest German daily newspapers use PostgreSQL in their CMS to store meta-information about the articles. http://www.zeit.de/software/index?page=all Regards Conni
On Mon, 2005-10-17 at 13:36, Josh Berkus wrote:
> Jim,
>
> > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere?
>
> Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done:
>
> 1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL
> users.
> 2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and
> verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up.
> 3) Draft an xhtml page with the list.
>
FWIW if someone will do #1 & #2 I'll gladly take care of getting #3 into
the website.
Robert Treat
--
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
On 10/14/05, Andy Hester <ahester@galacticltd.com> wrote: > Hello, > I am a network/security guy not a dba. And you got internal applications based on MS SQL and most likely Exchange. I call this the "Armadillo Security Model" - hard on the outside, soft on the inside ;-) > One argument he makes repeatedly is that there is no database that is > enterprise worthy for a cost even comparable to MSSQL. There is a company here in Manhattan that is an up-and-coming financial services company. They were using MS SQL for their internal data processing, and ran into trouble running queries with 20 joins (or more, cannot remember the details). In short, the queries actually wouldn't run, and MS SQL wouldn't have anything to do with such nonsense... When they asked about an Open Source alternative, I answered "PostgreSQL" without any hesitation. They ran an evaluation (thanks to PostgreSQL being free to use) and not only learned that their monster joins went well, but overall performance (on the same hardware) improved. I'm now told that my advice may have shaved up to three months from their internal schedule as a result of their blossoming love fest with PostgreSQL. My all-time favorite quote from the CTO: "Every day I get a little more experience with PostgreSQL, and every day I get to liking it just a little bit more than yesterday." -- Mitch
On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 09:24:04PM -0400, Mitch Pirtle wrote: > On 10/14/05, Andy Hester <ahester@galacticltd.com> wrote: > > Hello, > > I am a network/security guy not a dba. > > And you got internal applications based on MS SQL and most likely > Exchange. I call this the "Armadillo Security Model" - hard on the > outside, soft on the inside ;-) > > > One argument he makes repeatedly is that there is no database that is > > enterprise worthy for a cost even comparable to MSSQL. > > There is a company here in Manhattan that is an up-and-coming > financial services company. They were using MS SQL for their internal > data processing, and ran into trouble running queries with 20 joins > (or more, cannot remember the details). In short, the queries actually > wouldn't run, and MS SQL wouldn't have anything to do with such > nonsense... > > When they asked about an Open Source alternative, I answered > "PostgreSQL" without any hesitation. They ran an evaluation (thanks to > PostgreSQL being free to use) and not only learned that their monster > joins went well, but overall performance (on the same hardware) > improved. > > I'm now told that my advice may have shaved up to three months from > their internal schedule as a result of their blossoming love fest with > PostgreSQL. My all-time favorite quote from the CTO: "Every day I get > a little more experience with PostgreSQL, and every day I get to > liking it just a little bit more than yesterday." I've got just two words on this: Case Study :) Cheers, D (does an emoticon count as an extra word?) -- David Fetter david@fetter.org http://fetter.org/ phone: +1 510 893 6100 mobile: +1 415 235 3778 Remember to vote!
On 10/17/05, David Fetter <david@fetter.org> wrote: > > I've got just two words on this: > > Case Study :) Yeah, that is why I brought them up, they did mention that they would be into something like that - and in a meeting later this week I will get a feel for how comfortable they are, and when they would like to do it. -- Mitch
On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 04:18:21PM -0400, Robert Treat wrote: > On Mon, 2005-10-17 at 13:36, Josh Berkus wrote: > > Jim, > > > > > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? > > > > Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done: > > > > 1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL > > users. > > 2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and > > verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up. > > 3) Draft an xhtml page with the list. > > > > FWIW if someone will do #1 & #2 I'll gladly take care of getting #3 into > the website. I (or possibly someone else here at Pervasive) is going to work on #1 and #2. Additional help welcome, though. -- Jim C. Nasby, Sr. Engineering Consultant jnasby@pervasive.com Pervasive Software http://pervasive.com work: 512-231-6117 vcard: http://jim.nasby.net/pervasive.vcf cell: 512-569-9461
On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 10:36:04AM -0700, Josh Berkus wrote: > Jim, > > > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? > > Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done: > > 1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL > users. Hrm, suggestions on what to search on? I haven't seen many emails about 'another company using PostgreSQL'... > 2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and > verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up. > 3) Draft an xhtml page with the list. > > --Josh > > -- > __Aglio Database Solutions_______________ > Josh Berkus Consultant > josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com > Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387 > 2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA > > ---------------------------(end of broadcast)--------------------------- > TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster > -- Jim C. Nasby, Sr. Engineering Consultant jnasby@pervasive.com Pervasive Software http://pervasive.com work: 512-231-6117 vcard: http://jim.nasby.net/pervasive.vcf cell: 512-569-9461
On Tue, 2005-10-18 at 10:42 -0500, Jim C. Nasby wrote: > On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 10:36:04AM -0700, Josh Berkus wrote: > > Jim, > > > > > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? > > > > Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done: > > > > 1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL > > users. > > Hrm, suggestions on what to search on? I haven't seen many emails about > 'another company using PostgreSQL'... Their domains are usually a good clue :) > > > 2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and > > verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up. > > 3) Draft an xhtml page with the list. > > > > --Josh > > > > -- > > __Aglio Database Solutions_______________ > > Josh Berkus Consultant > > josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com > > Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387 > > 2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA > > > > ---------------------------(end of broadcast)--------------------------- > > TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster > > > -- Your PostgreSQL solutions company - Command Prompt, Inc. 1.800.492.2240 PostgreSQL Replication, Consulting, Custom Programming, 24x7 support Managed Services, Shared and Dedicated Hosting Co-Authors: plPHP, plPerlNG - http://www.commandprompt.com/
On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 12:11:59PM -0500, Jim C. Nasby wrote: > Can we get any of that on the website somewhere? Afilias has been a pretty open user (and we're not in the league of some of those users, I understand). I have an unpleasant feeling that I've contributed to the hold up of our case study's posting; but in the meantime, if people want to use it, here's an old link with the arguments we used to make PostgreSQL palatable to the ICANN community. "What's a PostgreSQL" is not a question we hear much any more, but in 2002 it was still a big problem: http://icann.org/tlds/org/questions-to-applicants-13.htm A -- Andrew Sullivan | ajs@crankycanuck.ca This work was visionary and imaginative, and goes to show that visionary and imaginative work need not end up well. --Dennis Ritchie
Andy Hester wrote: >Hello, > I am a network/security guy not a dba. A friend is a developer/dba type. We >often debate whether open source software is viable for the enterprise or our >50 person company. He doesn't know much about Linux or opensource yet is >very dogmatic. > > Most people are.... > One argument he makes repeatedly is that there is no database that is >enterprise worthy for a cost even comparable to MSSQL. > On the advantages, MS SQL has at least a commercial attempt at multimaster replication (both async and sync). I suspect you can architect similar solutions with PGPool and/or Slony-I but these may be more complex to set up initially than MS SQL... Also it is mostly self-tuning on Windows. Finally, you have OLAP capabilities that are not included out of the box on PostgreSQL. On the disadvantages.... PostgreSQL is extremely pedantic about data integrity, an generally pedantic (aside from case folding) about standards-compliance in general. It is probably inferior to PostgreSQL in basic technical functions unless you have to run your RDBMS on Windows (then the process-based nature of PostgreSQL may give you some headaches when using a large number of concurrent users and small queries, but you may want to see how it builds on SFU if this is the case). For example, I am not really happy with the fact that what MS SQL calls "triggers" are really our rule system by another name and that they have no real trigger system of the sort that we, DB2, or Oracle have. Yes, it is sufficient for 80% of your cases, but it leaves some reasonable gaps in functionality. > He says that >Postegres is not even in the same class as MSSQL, DB2, Oracle. > If I were to rank them for enterprise capabilities: 1) Oracle and DB2 2) PostgreSQL 3) MS SQL Server Areas that Oracle and DB2 have us beat include the ability to do business intelligence on very large data sets with reasonable performance (via parallel queries running on partial data sets on different nodes (this alleviates a certain class of I/O bottlenecks when working on BI queries against, say, 2-4 TB of data with arbitrary constraints). I believe that Bizgres is working on this issue :-) But in most other areas, we are comparable, though they may have more mature replication solutions available. I used to work at Microsoft's Product Support Services. I was not impressed by MS SQL after hearing dealing with many support calls. > He often >points to the db benchmarks which of course, pg is not involved in because >you have to pay be involved. > > Well, let me point you to something else. I have a customer running an accounting application on PostgreSQL. After a while of using it for Point of Sale stuff, they started having some odd performance issues. So I turned on debugging, analyzed queries, submitted an analysis to the list and got a good answer from Tom Lane about what was going wrong and a few suggestions on how to fix it. I am not aware of any of the RDBMS's that you mention that has the ability to submit performance questions to the core developers. In essence there is no enterprise RDBMS which has better support than PostgreSQL (except perhaps FirebirdSQL and is sorely lacking in documentation). Now, regarding benchmarks (the TPC competitions), these are usually done by software/hardware vendors interested in promoting their projects. These are often multisystem clusters requiring multimaster replication, so drawing any real parallels between your 50 person company and the question of the TPC benchmarks in hundreds of transactions per second is likely to be misleading at best. Indeed I am sure that the DB2 cluster that was at the top a few years ago was probably using parallel queries. Finally, because performance is very query-specific and very data-set specific, one benchmark doesn't tell you very much about what performance your company is likely to get. To do this, what you will need to do is generate what is expected to be representative data and load, and test it on both SQL Server (you can download an eval version from Microsoft's web site), and PostgreSQL (ideally on Linux). Then run your own benchmarks based on your expected load, data, and query structures. Ask for help if you need performance tuning advice :-) > I thought that pg was on par with these, that is to say that in all but the >most demanding applications, you would never see the difference between good >implementations of each one. > > Please let me know if I am wrong. I would love to have some serious examples >to show that opensource is not a "toy" and can be used effectively in the >enterprise with all of the regular enterprise features. > Note that the .ORG TLD is mostly managed via PostgreSQL. .INFO too (but .ORG is much bigger and more impressive)? Also take a look at the case studies on http://www.postgresql.org/about/casestudies/ > I am sure everyone >is tired of comparison questions, but comparisons would be ok to. > > He probably still won't admit to it, but at least we will both know. :) > > Hope this helps. Chris Travers Metatron Technology Consulting
Well, it might be a lot of work, but starting with those asking for support, especially for multiple systems might be a good idea (the perform list archives perhaps?) For example, I remember helping a fellow from HP who was having issues with *some* HP-UX systems not connecting to the UNIX socket properly. Using gdb we were able to isolate the issue and it seemed to be either a kernel or standard library issue involving UNIX socket handling (-h localhost never caused the problem). So evidently HP is using it for something, but I don't know what. Best Wishes, Chris Travers Metatron Technology Consulting
Chris Travers wrote: > On the advantages, MS SQL has at least a commercial attempt at > multimaster replication (both async and sync). I suspect you can > architect similar solutions with PGPool and/or Slony-I but these may be > more complex to set up initially than MS SQL... I haven't maintained a MSSQL replication personally, but a co-worker did for some years and apparently a simple async master-slave replication needed quite some effort to implement, needing lengthy scripts since the Enterprise Manager didn't work for that situation); in addition it broke down from time to time, requiring a fresh initial setup. I'm quite sure that Slony-I performs at least as good (frankly, I believe the architecture is much better). > Also it is mostly self-tuning on Windows. Agreed; pgsql can never be as good in this discipline, too many platforms. > For example, I am not really happy with the fact that what MS > SQL calls "triggers" are really our rule system by another name and that > they have no real trigger system of the sort that we, DB2, or Oracle > have. Yes, it is sufficient for 80% of your cases, but it leaves some > reasonable gaps in functionality. Um, MSSQL triggers == pgsql rules? All TSQL language structs may be used (e.g. IF); pgsql rules lack plpgsql or similar for this, which allows simple rules only. In fact, I like MSSQL triggers when it comes to volume oriented work. I once programmed a system where a single query might affect thousands of rows, which in turn triggers changes in another table, also with triggers... Works fine with decent performance. With statement triggers, this effectively leads to three statements on larger rowsets, which can be optimized by the planner, while doing it with row level triggers each row will create an individual query on small rowsets. BTW here's a current weakness of pgsql: statement triggers still don't allow access to affected rowsets using OLD and NEW. > > I used to work at Microsoft's Product Support Services. I was not > impressed by MS SQL after hearing dealing with many support calls. When I started adapting a win32 app (fairly portable developed on MSSQL) to PostgreSQL, I got about 6 issues that had to be solved. 5 issues were pgsql related, all of them solved in less than 24 hours. The 6th was a MS software related problem (OLEDB driver), handled as paid case. After 6 weeks, the case was closed with "yes, this is a MS bug, we won't fix it because it appears irrelevant to us". Regards, Andreas
Jim C. Nasby wrote: > On Mon, Oct 17, 2005 at 10:36:04AM -0700, Josh Berkus wrote: >>Sure, it's just some clerical work. Here's what needs to be done: >> >>1) search the archives of this list and assemble a list of PostgreSQL >>users. > > Hrm, suggestions on what to search on? I haven't seen many emails about > 'another company using PostgreSQL'... I find searching for resumes to be a good way to find references in a specific industry. For example, for use in the military: For example http://kennethbowen.com/kbresume.html "Northrop Grumman... Navy... Develop J2EE application to store user profiles for the Navy Enterprise Portal and the FleetNumerical Meteorology and Oceanography Center(FNMOC) Portal using JBoss application server and PostgreSQL database." >>2) Contact each one that has not already been quoted/case studied and >>verify that it's OK to put their name/logo up. If a company themselves announces that they use PostgreSQL we could probably put up their name and links to where they make such claims. That would include: Cisco: Cisco's Carrier-Sensitive Routing application uses PostgreSQL. http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/sw/voicesw/ps4371/products_user_guide_chapter09186a00800c252c.html http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/sw/voicesw/ps4371/products_user_guide_chapter09186a00800c252e.html#xtocid3 " The postgreSQL database is a relational database management system. A database in this management system storesentities such as carriers, rules, contacts, routes, and the relationships among the entities." Cisco's IP/TV Program Manager http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/product/webscale/iptv/iptv51/pm_usrgd/chap4.htm "OnDemand Manager and IP/TV Program Manager Administration use a PostgreSQL database to store information abouton-demand programs and servers. A second database stores information about the journal records of OnDemand sessions." Apple: http://developer.apple.com/appleapplications/ardsql.html "This article shows you how to access the data in Apple Remote Desktop 2's PostgreSQL database" and many others. Though I agree contacting them for permission to also use their logo would be very nice to them and to us. Also, the PostGIS mailinglist is full of good examples or larger systems. For example: GlobeXplorer GlobeXplorer has an 18 terrabyte postgresql database with the postgis extention: http://postgis.refractions.net/pipermail/postgis-users/2005-March/007398.html Sanz (DOD, USGS, USDA, Army Corp of Engineers, Navy) Sanz manages "tens of terrabyte datasets of raster and vector datafor the DOD, USGS, USDA, Army Corp of Engineers, Navy, etc." using postgresql and postgis http://postgis.refractions.net/pipermail/postgis-users/2005-March/007399.html Finally, I think it'd be great of the Postgresql website had a search-engine that crawled all the various job-sites (dice/monster) because job postings requiring postgresql skills are an excellent indicator that a company uses postgresql. >>3) Draft an xhtml page with the list. >> >>--Josh >> >>-- >>__Aglio Database Solutions_______________ >>Josh Berkus Consultant >>josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com >>Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387 >>2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA >> >>---------------------------(end of broadcast)--------------------------- >>TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster >> > >
On Tue, Oct 18, 2005 at 12:15:33PM -0700, Chris Travers wrote:
> Note that the .ORG TLD is mostly managed via PostgreSQL. .INFO too (but
> .ORG is much bigger and more impressive)? Also take a look at the case
Actually, it may surprise y'all to know this, but last year info was
actually bigger than org for a little while. Afilias has been very
aggressive in building .info, and intends to continue. In late 2004,
.info added a million names in two days (though, in the spirit of
openness, I'll point out that part of that was due to a sales
promotion, so we don't expect 100% of them to renew). While I'm
being all rah-rah, I'll also point out, for those of you in the
web-design business, that .info has available an awful lot of those
desirable strings that have been taken up in .com. Here, for
instance, are some interesting random finds:
andrew@dba3:~$ whois oraclecorp.info
NOT FOUND
whois ibmdb2.info
NOT FOUND
whois mssqlserver.info
NOT FOUND
whois mysqlab.info
NOT FOUND
(Sorry, folks, that was just too tempting.)
To drag this back on topic, I should note, also, that several country
code TLDs, including .IN, use PostgreSQL. Folks at Afilias (not
including me, but including Chris Browne, of Slony fame) got the .IN
registry up and running in something around 6 weeks last year, and
the .IN registry experienced the highest growth of any top-level
domain since .info went live in 2001, beating the .cn re-launch in
percentage growth.
Our experience with PostgreSQL has been extremely positive; that's
why we keep putting more systems on it, and why we devote resources,
including staff resources, to it. We're not a database-support
company, and yet we employ a back end developer full time, and put
other staff members to work on projects like Slony (and have them
show up here, too). That's not charity. It's just good sense: we
run our registries (i.e. our core business) on PostgreSQL; we have a
custom accounting system we built with PostgreSQL; we do just about
everything with PostgreSQL. But because we have access to the source
code, we can be better experts in our database technology than any of
our competitors can be in theirs (well, until they get the right
idea, too; but now we have a four year head start). That's why we
can get systems up and running faster than anyone else in our
industry.
Ok, I'll stop gushing now.
A
--
Andrew Sullivan | ajs@crankycanuck.ca
I remember when computers were frustrating because they *did* exactly what
you told them to. That actually seems sort of quaint now.
--J.D. Baldwin
On Tue, Oct 18, 2005 at 01:03:48PM -0700, Ron Mayer wrote:
>
> If a company themselves announces that they use PostgreSQL we could
> probably put up their name and links to where they make such claims.
Well, if you do this, you potentially run afoul of their marketing
departments, who tend to get grumpy when they're not consulted on
marketing initiatives by others. So you'd better make sure that such
links are official company lines.
A
--
Andrew Sullivan | ajs@crankycanuck.ca
It is above all style through which power defers to reason.
--J. Robert Oppenheimer
> I (or possibly someone else here at Pervasive) is going to work on #1 > and #2. Additional help welcome, though. I just sent a case study of our company (calorieking.com) to Gavin Sherry... Chris
On Wed, 19 Oct 2005, Christopher Kings-Lynne wrote: > > I (or possibly someone else here at Pervasive) is going to work on #1 > > and #2. Additional help welcome, though. > > I just sent a case study of our company (calorieking.com) to Gavin Sherry... I am working on putting it together into something that looks like a case study. Then I will get it professionally laid out. I currently have 2 that I am writing and 1 being laid out. It would be great if we could have 5 really great case studies for launch of 8.1. Thanks, gavin
>>I just sent a case study of our company (calorieking.com) to Gavin Sherry... > > > I am working on putting it together into something that looks like a case > study. Then I will get it professionally laid out. I currently have 2 that > I am writing and 1 being laid out. It would be great if we could have 5 > really great case studies for launch of 8.1. Pity we're still using 7.4 :D Chris
Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Tue, Oct 18, 2005 at 01:03:48PM -0700, Ron Mayer wrote: > >>If a company themselves announces that they use PostgreSQL we could >>probably put up their name and links to where they make such claims. > > Well, if you do this, you potentially run afoul of their marketing > departments, who tend to get grumpy when they're not consulted on > marketing initiatives by others. So you'd better make sure that such > links are official company lines. IMHO it all depends on how we present those links. If we call the page "these guys endorse PostgreSQL" of course we'd get cease&desist letters; since that's simply false. If we call the page "links mentioning PostgreSQL on other corporate sites" it's hard for me to imagine any complaints from even the most uptight marketing department. At that point all it does is drive traffic and help their google page-rank score.
On Wed, Oct 19, 2005 at 10:56:33AM +0800, Christopher Kings-Lynne wrote: > >>I just sent a case study of our company (calorieking.com) to Gavin > >>Sherry... > > > > > >I am working on putting it together into something that looks like a case > >study. Then I will get it professionally laid out. I currently have 2 that > >I am writing and 1 being laid out. It would be great if we could have 5 > >really great case studies for launch of 8.1. > > Pity we're still using 7.4 :D Well, odds of getting case studies of 8.1 for the 8.1 release are pretty low. I don't think the version matters a great deal as long as it's in recent history. -- Jim C. Nasby, Sr. Engineering Consultant jnasby@pervasive.com Pervasive Software http://pervasive.com work: 512-231-6117 vcard: http://jim.nasby.net/pervasive.vcf cell: 512-569-9461