Thread: Suggestion: new frontpage layout

Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others, I've put up a
suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some more stuff
than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.

Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us" pending
new image-files from Tom ;-)

Comments?

//Magnus

I think it is nice, and it is quick to grasp.

Those columns of actual information suggest that it is a very lively project.

I like it.

Harald



--
GHUM Harald Massa
persuadere et programmare
Harald Armin Massa
Reinsburgstraße 202b
70197 Stuttgart
0173/9409607
-
Python: the only language with more web frameworks than keywords.

Magnus Hagander wrote:
> Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others, I've put
> up a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some
> more stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
>
> Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> pending new image-files from Tom ;-)

I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front page.  That
gives random individuals unchecked (until after the fact) access to
post on the front page.  Seeing that Devrim has in fact in the past
resisted making planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to keep
the efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the rationale
for making this change?

--
Peter Eisentraut
http://developer.postgresql.org/~petere/

On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 19:09 +0100, Peter Eisentraut wrote:
> Magnus Hagander wrote:
> > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others, I've put
> > up a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some
> > more stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> >
> > Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> > pending new image-files from Tom ;-)
>
> I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front page.  That
> gives random individuals unchecked (until after the fact) access to
> post on the front page.  Seeing that Devrim has in fact in the past
> resisted making planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to keep
> the efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the rationale
> for making this change?

I think that having planetpostgresql on the front page is not a good
idea. Maybe, put it under community instead? As an example, I use the
planetpostgresql blog for a personal blog, not a professional one. Which
means, I very well will put things up there that really shouldn't be up
on the front page of postgresql.org.

My article on Oil profits being a perfect example.

Joshua D. Drake



>
--

      === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive  PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
             http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate

> > Magnus Hagander wrote:
> > > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few
> others, I've put
> > > up a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some
> > > more stuff than before. It's up on
> http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> > >
> > > Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> > > pending new image-files from Tom ;-)
> >
> > I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front
> page.  That
> > gives random individuals unchecked (until after the fact) access to
> > post on the front page.  Seeing that Devrim has in fact in the past
> > resisted making planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to
> > keep the efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the
> > rationale for making this change?
>
> I think that having planetpostgresql on the front page is not
> a good idea. Maybe, put it under community instead?

It's already there.


> As an example, I use the planetpostgresql blog for a personal blog,
> not a professional one. Which means, I very well will put
> things up there that really shouldn't be up on the front page
> of postgresql.org.
>
> My article on Oil profits being a perfect example.

For that, you should be using categories, and make sure that
www.planetpostgresql.org only carries the PostgreSQL articles. I know
others have done just that (can't remember an example right now, but I
think xzilla does), and it works just fine.

Remember, www.planetpostgresql.org != people.planetpostgresql.org.

//Magnus

> > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others,
> I've put up
> > a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some more
> > stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> >
> > Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> > pending new image-files from Tom ;-)
>
> I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front
> page.  That gives random individuals unchecked (until after
> the fact) access to post on the front page.  Seeing that
> Devrim has in fact in the past resisted making
> planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to keep the
> efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the
> rationale for making this change?

The rationale is that there is a lot of good articles posted there that
would get promoted to the frontpage. Such as the PWN, but that's just
one of many examples. It also "brings life" to the page because there is
a list of content that actually changes reasonably often.

While it's certainly not "random individuals", you definitly have a
point in that it's unchecked.

//Magnus

On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 07:26:31PM +0100, Magnus Hagander wrote:
> > > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others,
> > I've put up
> > > a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some more
> > > stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> > >
> > > Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> > > pending new image-files from Tom ;-)
> >
> > I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front
> > page.  That gives random individuals unchecked (until after
> > the fact) access to post on the front page.  Seeing that
> > Devrim has in fact in the past resisted making
> > planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to keep the
> > efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the
> > rationale for making this change?
>
> The rationale is that there is a lot of good articles posted there
> that would get promoted to the frontpage. Such as the PWN,

I already post the PostgreSQL Weekly News to www.postgresql.org as I'm
publishing it.  I'd be delighted to have it get a more prominent place
than 3 clicks down.  Right now, you can see it by the blindingly
obvious ;) method of clicking on Community, then finding the link
marked PostgreSQL Weekly News in the text, and then choosing the top
link.

> but that's just one of many examples. It also "brings life" to the
> page because there is a list of content that actually changes
> reasonably often.

Right.

> While it's certainly not "random individuals", you definitly have a
> point in that it's unchecked.

True.  We could have certain "categories" get on the page, and others
not.  For example, I have a category called PWN.  I'm not sure how
portable that is, though.

Cheers,
D
--
David Fetter <david@fetter.org> http://fetter.org/
phone: +1 415 235 3778        AIM: dfetter666
                              Skype: davidfetter

Remember to vote!

Hi,

On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 19:09 +0100, Peter Eisentraut wrote:
> What is the rationale for making this change?

I don't know why Magnus put Planet PostgreSQL to front page (I like the
idea BTW...) but I want to write something about this:

As I have told several times, my aim was to create an area for
PostgreSQL people who want to share their lives, knowlegde, etc. with
other people. There are lots of planets outside. Our is yet another
planet. We have important articles there. Also, David posts PWN to
Planet (I read PWN from Planet).

For example, look at Planet Debian: http://planet.debian.org

Look at what people write there. There are lots of example in the form
planet.PROJECTNAME.org

More planets: http://planetkde.org/ http://planetjava.org/
http://planet.go-oo.org/ http://www.planetpython.org/

Now, as you said, I resist to "planet.PostgreSQL.org". Here are the
reasons:

1) This is my project and I want to run it in a different mind.
2) If we use planet.PostgreSQL.org, we may need to apply some rules . I
don't want it (at least for now...)

I am not the only admin: Magnus, Robert and I manage it.

All of the bloggers have something to share with us except PostgreSQL:
For example, I can write a review on FC6. Robert writes on PHP. . We are
all PostgreSQL people -- so no problem with those articles.

To sum up: I'm for putting Planet to frontpage so that we can provide
some more to the people who visit our webpage.

Regards,
--
The PostgreSQL Company - Command Prompt, Inc. 1.503.667.4564
PostgreSQL Replication, Consulting, Custom Development, 24x7 support
Managed Services, Shared and Dedicated Hosting
Co-Authors: plPHP, plPerlNG - http://www.commandprompt.com/

On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 12:05 -0800, David Fetter wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 07:26:31PM +0100, Magnus Hagander wrote:
> > > > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others,
> > > I've put up
> > > > a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some more
> > > > stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> > > >

I think it looks great - Latest Releases text doesn't line up for me
though, not sure why.

> > > > Note: The planetpostgresql header currently reads "support us"
> > > > pending new image-files from Tom ;-)
> > >
> > > I'm not happy about posting planetpostgresql on the front
> > > page.  That gives random individuals unchecked (until after
> > > the fact) access to post on the front page.  Seeing that
> > > Devrim has in fact in the past resisted making
> > > planetpostgresql.org into planet.postgresql.org to keep the
> > > efforts unrelated, that seems contradictory.  What is the
> > > rationale for making this change?
> >
> > The rationale is that there is a lot of good articles posted there
> > that would get promoted to the frontpage. Such as the PWN,
>
> I already post the PostgreSQL Weekly News to www.postgresql.org as I'm
> publishing it.  I'd be delighted to have it get a more prominent place
> than 3 clicks down.  Right now, you can see it by the blindingly
> obvious ;) method of clicking on Community, then finding the link
> marked PostgreSQL Weekly News in the text, and then choosing the top
> link.

It wasn't my idea to put blogs on the home page, note, but I think its a
great idea and I wish I'd thought of it. Look at the top blog: a great
article by Josh about PostgreSQL performance. What could be more useful?
More importantly, will make people come back to the site once they see
the whole community in action.

PWN has long been a favourite of mine, Treat or Fetter versions :-)
It deserves its place on the front-page.

All of these things deserve space on the front page and Magnus' new
design allows that without significantly changing the look/feel/design.

> > but that's just one of many examples. It also "brings life" to the
> > page because there is a list of content that actually changes
> > reasonably often.
>
> Right.
>
> > While it's certainly not "random individuals", you definitly have a
> > point in that it's unchecked.
>
> True.  We could have certain "categories" get on the page, and others
> not.  For example, I have a category called PWN.  I'm not sure how
> portable that is, though.

The fact that some people want to blog about their lives is nice, but
reasonably this can be done on other sites... we've always managed to
maintain a pleasant but impersonal atmosphere on PostgreSQL project. I
don't see the need to have my or anybody else's lives recorded anywhere
that has the PostgreSQL name but that's probably just me being a stuffy
Brit.

--
  Simon Riggs
  EnterpriseDB   http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 10:24:57PM +0000, Simon Riggs wrote:

> > > The rationale is that there is a lot of good articles posted
> > > there that would get promoted to the frontpage. Such as the PWN,
> >
> > I already post the PostgreSQL Weekly News to www.postgresql.org as
> > I'm publishing it.  I'd be delighted to have it get a more
> > prominent place than 3 clicks down.  Right now, you can see it by
> > the blindingly obvious ;) method of clicking on Community, then
> > finding the link marked PostgreSQL Weekly News in the text, and
> > then choosing the top link.
>
> It wasn't my idea to put blogs on the home page, note, but I think
> its a great idea and I wish I'd thought of it. Look at the top blog:
> a great article by Josh about PostgreSQL performance. What could be
> more useful?  More importantly, will make people come back to the
> site once they see the whole community in action.
>
> PWN has long been a favourite of mine, Treat or Fetter versions :-)
> It deserves its place on the front-page.

Thanks :)

> > > While it's certainly not "random individuals", you definitly
> > > have a point in that it's unchecked.
> >
> > True.  We could have certain "categories" get on the page, and
> > others not.  For example, I have a category called PWN.  I'm not
> > sure how portable that is, though.
>
> The fact that some people want to blog about their lives is nice,
> but reasonably this can be done on other sites... we've always
> managed to maintain a pleasant but impersonal atmosphere on
> PostgreSQL project. I don't see the need to have my or anybody
> else's lives recorded anywhere that has the PostgreSQL name but
> that's probably just me being a stuffy Brit.

Sorry I wasn't clearer on this.  I put PostgreSQL Weekly News in the
PWN category, so it's easy to distinguish as something that can and
should be syndicated as PostgreSQL content.

If I happen to blog about underwater basket-weaving, Guinness Stout
fermentation dregs, uranium mill tailings, muffler cores, monosodium
glutamate, nitrates, nitrites, nitrotes, nitrutes, or how certain
politicians should get an all-expense-paid trip to the War Crimes
Tribunal at the Hague, I can put them in a different category so they
don't show up on the www.postgresql.org home page.

Cheers,
D
--
David Fetter <david@fetter.org> http://fetter.org/
phone: +1 415 235 3778        AIM: dfetter666
                              Skype: davidfetter

Remember to vote!

On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 22:24 +0000, Simon Riggs wrote:
> On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 12:05 -0800, David Fetter wrote:
> > On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 07:26:31PM +0100, Magnus Hagander wrote:
> > > > > Based on suggestions from Simon (mainly) and a few others,
> > > > I've put up
> > > > > a suggestion for a new layout on the frontpage that shows some more
> > > > > stuff than before. It's up on http://magnus-master.pgadmin.org/.
> > > > >
>
> I think it looks great - Latest Releases text doesn't line up for me
> though, not sure why.

I get some alignment issues on the bottom three blocks
(new/events/planet) but I must admit it looks pretty good.

> >
> > True.  We could have certain "categories" get on the page, and others
> > not.  For example, I have a category called PWN.  I'm not sure how
> > portable that is, though.
>
> The fact that some people want to blog about their lives is nice, but
> reasonably this can be done on other sites... we've always managed to
> maintain a pleasant but impersonal atmosphere on PostgreSQL project.

I think it is unreasonable to expect people to keep seperate blogs.
Except for my family, my life *is* pretty much PostgreSQL. Thus many
things that don't seem relevant to some, may seem relevant to others.

I, as a geek + business person, will blog very directly about topics
that do not to you seem relevant because I am not talking about TRUNCATE
or FOREIGN KEYS. However, to a person trying to derive a profit from
PostgreSQL, they may be relevant.

Also it is relevant that my daughter got the flu, because it is likely
that I now may get the flu and thus will effect the things that I do for
the community for a short time. It is also relevant because Darcy's
daughter also got the flu, and thus he can empathize with the current
situation (this example is just and example btw).

Life is personal.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake


>  I
> don't see the need to have my or anybody else's lives recorded anywhere
> that has the PostgreSQL name but that's probably just me being a stuffy
> Brit.
>
--

      === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive  PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
             http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate

> If I happen to blog about underwater basket-weaving, Guinness Stout

Hmmmm Guiness....

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake

--

      === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive  PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
             http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate

Joshua D. Drake wrote:
> I think it is unreasonable to expect people to keep seperate blogs.
> Except for my family, my life *is* pretty much PostgreSQL. Thus many
> things that don't seem relevant to some, may seem relevant to others.
>
> I, as a geek + business person, will blog very directly about topics
> that do not to you seem relevant because I am not talking about TRUNCATE
> or FOREIGN KEYS. However, to a person trying to derive a profit from
> PostgreSQL, they may be relevant.
>
> Also it is relevant that my daughter got the flu, because it is likely
> that I now may get the flu and thus will effect the things that I do for
> the community for a short time. It is also relevant because Darcy's
> daughter also got the flu, and thus he can empathize with the current
> situation (this example is just and example btw).

A simple answer would be to simply filter what we display on the front
page of the site. istm there is no reason why we cannot a) restrict the
articles shown to only those from specific authors, and b) restrict the
articles from those authors to ones in specifc categories.

That way, if Joshua wants to post a useful howto, he can do so, and
categorise it under 'PostgreSQL' to have it show up on the front page of
the site. If he wants to blog about his pet cats latest antics then he
can categorise under 'Family' which won't show up on the front page.

There is some valuable stuff on planetpostgresql, it would be good to
include it if we can.

Regards, Dave.

> > I think it is unreasonable to expect people to keep seperate blogs.
> > Except for my family, my life *is* pretty much PostgreSQL.
> Thus many
> > things that don't seem relevant to some, may seem relevant
> to others.
> >
> > I, as a geek + business person, will blog very directly
> about topics
> > that do not to you seem relevant because I am not talking about
> > TRUNCATE or FOREIGN KEYS. However, to a person trying to derive a
> > profit from PostgreSQL, they may be relevant.
> >
> > Also it is relevant that my daughter got the flu, because
> it is likely
> > that I now may get the flu and thus will effect the things
> that I do
> > for the community for a short time. It is also relevant because
> > Darcy's daughter also got the flu, and thus he can
> empathize with the
> > current situation (this example is just and example btw).
>
> A simple answer would be to simply filter what we display on
> the front page of the site. istm there is no reason why we
> cannot a) restrict the articles shown to only those from
> specific authors, and b) restrict the articles from those
> authors to ones in specifc categories.

Filter for (a) implemented and tested.
Filter for (b) we can't do, since planet doesn't export it. THat
restriction has to be done at the planet level.


> That way, if Joshua wants to post a useful howto, he can do
> so, and categorise it under 'PostgreSQL' to have it show up
> on the front page of the site. If he wants to blog about his
> pet cats latest antics then he can categorise under 'Family'
> which won't show up on the front page.

Yes, but that requires him to use categories on his blog, which he says
is too much work :-) But we can now filter his entire blog (or that of
others), which might be an incentive.


> There is some valuable stuff on planetpostgresql, it would be
> good to include it if we can.



Ok. The large majority of the people who have said something are clearly
for this one. I haev implemented this filter to help mitigate the main
issue brought forward by the people opposed.

Given this, unless someone screams loudly with what's actual new
information, I will commit this change later tonight.


//Magnus