Thread: pgAdmin Icon
While we are on the topic of logos, I want to point out how awful the pgAdmin icon looks. It looks like it was blown up from an 8x8 pixel MS Paint drawing. On Ubuntu the icon looks absolutely out of place in a panel full of high color, 3D looking logos. On Windows, it doesn't stand out quite as much (at least on XP, no idea about Vista or 7). But I guarantee it will be the ugliest looking icon on your taskbar. For someone installing Postgres on their system, this is THE graphical representation of Postgres. And I think the message it is sending about us is not very good... especially when we high quality icons available on pgFoundry. My 2 cents. Scott Bailey
On 11/19/09 9:07 AM, Scott Bailey wrote: > While we are on the topic of logos, I want to point out how awful the > pgAdmin icon looks. It looks like it was blown up from an 8x8 pixel MS > Paint drawing. > > On Ubuntu the icon looks absolutely out of place in a panel full of high > color, 3D looking logos. On Windows, it doesn't stand out quite as much > (at least on XP, no idea about Vista or 7). But I guarantee it will be > the ugliest looking icon on your taskbar. For someone installing > Postgres on their system, this is THE graphical representation of > Postgres. And I think the message it is sending about us is not very > good... especially when we high quality icons available on pgFoundry. Patch? ;-) --Josh
Le jeudi 19 novembre 2009 à 01:07:26, Scott Bailey a écrit : > While we are on the topic of logos, I want to point out how awful the > pgAdmin icon looks. It looks like it was blown up from an 8x8 pixel MS > Paint drawing. > > On Ubuntu the icon looks absolutely out of place in a panel full of high > color, 3D looking logos. On Windows, it doesn't stand out quite as much > (at least on XP, no idea about Vista or 7). But I guarantee it will be > the ugliest looking icon on your taskbar. For someone installing > Postgres on their system, this is THE graphical representation of > Postgres. And I think the message it is sending about us is not very > good... especially when we high quality icons available on pgFoundry. > You're welcome to send us a better icon. I mean a better icon that will be displayed great on Linux, Windows, and Mac OS X. Honestly I didn't remember about this because I don't use an icon to launch this tool :) (well, in fact, I did know about it because there is already a ticket in the bugtracker of Debian or Ubuntu... but I'm definitely not a designer) -- Guillaume. http://www.postgresqlfr.org http://dalibo.com
On tor, 2009-11-19 at 09:43 +0900, Josh Berkus wrote: > On 11/19/09 9:07 AM, Scott Bailey wrote: > > While we are on the topic of logos, I want to point out how awful the > > pgAdmin icon looks. It looks like it was blown up from an 8x8 pixel MS > > Paint drawing. > > > > On Ubuntu the icon looks absolutely out of place in a panel full of high > > color, 3D looking logos. On Windows, it doesn't stand out quite as much > > (at least on XP, no idea about Vista or 7). But I guarantee it will be > > the ugliest looking icon on your taskbar. For someone installing > > Postgres on their system, this is THE graphical representation of > > Postgres. And I think the message it is sending about us is not very > > good... especially when we high quality icons available on pgFoundry. > > Patch? > > ;-) The icon is available in all the formats of the world. You just need to use them. Clearly, the people behind pgAdmin and StackBuilder can create the logic to select the right icon format depending on the platform.
Guillaume Lelarge wrote: > Le jeudi 19 novembre 2009 à 01:07:26, Scott Bailey a écrit : >> While we are on the topic of logos, I want to point out how awful the >> pgAdmin icon looks. It looks like it was blown up from an 8x8 pixel MS >> Paint drawing. >> >> On Ubuntu the icon looks absolutely out of place in a panel full of high >> color, 3D looking logos. On Windows, it doesn't stand out quite as much >> (at least on XP, no idea about Vista or 7). But I guarantee it will be >> the ugliest looking icon on your taskbar. For someone installing >> Postgres on their system, this is THE graphical representation of >> Postgres. And I think the message it is sending about us is not very >> good... especially when we high quality icons available on pgFoundry. >> > > You're welcome to send us a better icon. I mean a better icon that will be > displayed great on Linux, Windows, and Mac OS X. > > Honestly I didn't remember about this because I don't use an icon to launch > this tool :) (well, in fact, I did know about it because there is already a > ticket in the bugtracker of Debian or Ubuntu... but I'm definitely not a > designer) Attached is my stab at it. If we don't like that, there are tons of icons at http://pgfoundry.org/docman/?group_id=1000089 And the one of the front page of pgFoundry is nice too. It would need shrunk a bit. http://pgfoundry.org/images/elephantSmall.png
Attachment
Hmm
Sadly, the elephant is not an attractive icon and will always be a challenge to reproduce.
I personally think that the PG elephant looks evil. Those beady eyes worry me. :)
Compare it, for example, to the highly stylized but very attractive Java icon.
I do agree with keeping the elephant. It has too much history and brand awareness. But it needs to be more stylized. Is it worth getting ideas from some of my designer clients? I would not want to approach them unless there was a general willingness to change.
What are the benefits and disadvantages of changing? The benefits are clear enough. For people publishing books, documentation, websites, etc. it would create work and immediately date some material.
I am extremely nervous about considering doing a logo re-design with so many people involved in the evaluation and review process but it’s worth a shot.
But I don’t see changing the logo has to be rushed. It would best be tied to a major release (8.5?). And if it was to be introduced, all old versions should be dropped completely. Also, can we come up with a design for Japan that is the same as the rest of the world? The idea of having different logos for the same product is odd.
It seems that there are two camps: Those for changing it and those for staying the same. The Coca Cola and Ford logos are about 100 years old but they still work. So change just for the sake of it makes no sense.
I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not been available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply that people really do like it the way it is?
On 20/11/09 5:23 AM, "Scott Bailey" <artacus@comcast.net> wrote:
> Attached is my stab at it. If we don't like that, there are tons of
> icons at http://pgfoundry.org/docman/?group_id=1000089
>
> And the one of the front page of pgFoundry is nice too. It would need
> shrunk a bit.
> http://pgfoundry.org/images/elephantSmall.png
>
>
Regards
Rob Napier
Sadly, the elephant is not an attractive icon and will always be a challenge to reproduce.
I personally think that the PG elephant looks evil. Those beady eyes worry me. :)
Compare it, for example, to the highly stylized but very attractive Java icon.
I do agree with keeping the elephant. It has too much history and brand awareness. But it needs to be more stylized. Is it worth getting ideas from some of my designer clients? I would not want to approach them unless there was a general willingness to change.
What are the benefits and disadvantages of changing? The benefits are clear enough. For people publishing books, documentation, websites, etc. it would create work and immediately date some material.
I am extremely nervous about considering doing a logo re-design with so many people involved in the evaluation and review process but it’s worth a shot.
But I don’t see changing the logo has to be rushed. It would best be tied to a major release (8.5?). And if it was to be introduced, all old versions should be dropped completely. Also, can we come up with a design for Japan that is the same as the rest of the world? The idea of having different logos for the same product is odd.
It seems that there are two camps: Those for changing it and those for staying the same. The Coca Cola and Ford logos are about 100 years old but they still work. So change just for the sake of it makes no sense.
I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not been available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply that people really do like it the way it is?
On 20/11/09 5:23 AM, "Scott Bailey" <artacus@comcast.net> wrote:
> Attached is my stab at it. If we don't like that, there are tons of
> icons at http://pgfoundry.org/docman/?group_id=1000089
>
> And the one of the front page of pgFoundry is nice too. It would need
> shrunk a bit.
> http://pgfoundry.org/images/elephantSmall.png
>
>
Regards
Rob Napier
On fre, 2009-11-20 at 07:02 +1100, Rob Napier wrote: > I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not > been > available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply > that > people really do like it the way it is? I really do like it the way it is.
No quiero seguir recibiendo vuestro emails
Date una vuelta por Sietes y conoce el pueblo de los expertos en Windows 7
Date una vuelta por Sietes y conoce el pueblo de los expertos en Windows 7
On 11/20/09 6:44 AM, Peter Eisentraut wrote: > On fre, 2009-11-20 at 07:02 +1100, Rob Napier wrote: >> I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not >> been >> available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply >> that >> people really do like it the way it is? > > I really do like it the way it is. Surely we have something more useful to discuss than the logo? --Josh Berkus
On Fri, 2009-11-20 at 09:55 +0900, Josh Berkus wrote: > On 11/20/09 6:44 AM, Peter Eisentraut wrote: > > On fre, 2009-11-20 at 07:02 +1100, Rob Napier wrote: > >> I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not > >> been > >> available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply > >> that > >> people really do like it the way it is? > > > > I really do like it the way it is. > > Surely we have something more useful to discuss than the logo? Not to feed the fire but.... Logos are important. If the logo is unprofessional (I am not actually casting an opinion, I don't use PgAdmin) then people are going to think it is an unprofessional app. Joshua D. Drake > > --Josh Berkus > > -- PostgreSQL.org Major Contributor Command Prompt, Inc: http://www.commandprompt.com/ - 503.667.4564 Consulting, Training, Support, Custom Development, Engineering If the world pushes look it in the eye and GRR. Then push back harder. - Salamander
> Logos are important. If the logo is unprofessional (I am not actually > casting an opinion, I don't use PgAdmin) then people are going to think > it is an unprofessional app. Our logo is already far above average for both free software and the database industry. Oracle, the most lucrative DB company, has an ugly logo which doesn't lend itself to any kind of derivatives or product logos; the other vendors are generally worse. Our graphic is recognizable, easy to reproduce in a variety of sizes, lends itself to both product and user group variants, applies well to merchandise, and is an attractive shade of blue which works well for clothing. The Japanese turtle is slightly more attractive but that animal has negative associations for Americans. I think the text portion of our logo could use some typography work (or we could just steal JPUG's verions) but frankly even that is better than the typography for Oracle, Ingres, or EnterpriseDB. Someone mentioned the Java logo as an example of a good logo. JUGS as a rule *hate* the java logo; it's tightly licensed, impersonal, and doesn't lend itself to createing user group variants. That's why there's been a number of attempts to create person/animal logos like Jack, Juggy and that triangle thing for the user groups. So, could we have a better logo? Maybe. Is our logo even 1% as significant as the other aspects of our weak marketing? No. If people have free time and are looking to improve our marketing, how about updating the text in postgresql.org/about? BTW, Scott, this has nothing to do with fixing the grainyness of the pgadmin icon, which is a simple bug-fix for the pgadmin project, and thanks for taking a stab at it! --Josh Berkus
On Fri, 2009-11-20 at 09:55 +0900, Josh Berkus wrote: > On 11/20/09 6:44 AM, Peter Eisentraut wrote: > > On fre, 2009-11-20 at 07:02 +1100, Rob Napier wrote: > >> I suspect that the logos have not changed because the skills have not > >> been > >> available to create something better. Is this the case or is it simply > >> that > >> people really do like it the way it is? > > > > I really do like it the way it is. > > Surely we have something more useful to discuss than the logo? Not to feed the fire but.... Logos are important. If the logo is unprofessional (I am not actually casting an opinion, I don't use PgAdmin) then people are going to think it is an unprofessional app. Joshua D. Drake > > --Josh Berkus > > -- PostgreSQL.org Major Contributor Command Prompt, Inc: http://www.commandprompt.com/ - 503.667.4564 Consulting, Training, Support, Custom Development, Engineering If the world pushes look it in the eye and GRR. Then push back harder. - Salamander