Thread: Postgresql Certifications.
I was surprised to find this
on google webclips.
I think certifications should be strictly under our community control, rather than some other vendor issuing Postgresql certified profressionals certificates.
Providing training is fine, but not issuing certificates for the same.
This could be even one of the measure for the community to raise funds and rightly identify PG candidates.
-- Luckys.
On 4/17/06, Rajesh Sharma <luckysharma@gmail.com> wrote: > I think certifications should be strictly under our community control, > rather than some other vendor issuing Postgresql certified profressionals > certificates. I have an idea, we'll register PostgreSQL as a trademark and charge a fee for any vendor or consultant that says PostgreSQL-anything; that way no one can have certifications unless they're under contract with us! Better yet, they have to pay us royalties for using the PostgreSQL name and providing downloads of the software. It isn't April Fools again, is it? Because I don't know where you've been living, but in most parts of the world, companies are free to do pretty much whatever they want. Frankly, certification is a business venture and not something an open source project should get into managing. I believe this was discussed in the archives before. Besides, it seems pretty "proprietary" to limit certification to the project itself doesn't it??? I was pretty sure this was "open" source. Oh well, I'm done laughing now. -- Jonah H. Harris, Database Internals Architect EnterpriseDB Corporation 732.331.1324
-----Original Message-----
From: "Jonah H. Harris"<jonah.harris@gmail.com>
Sent: 17/04/06 11:58:37
To: "Rajesh Sharma"<luckysharma@gmail.com>
Cc: "pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org"<pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org>
Subject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] Postgresql Certifications.
> I have an idea, we'll register PostgreSQL as a trademark
Marc already did.
Regards, Dave
-----Unmodified Original Message-----
On 4/17/06, Rajesh Sharma <luckysharma@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think certifications should be strictly under our community control,
> rather than some other vendor issuing Postgresql certified profressionals
> certificates.
I have an idea, we'll register PostgreSQL as a trademark and charge a
fee for any vendor or consultant that says PostgreSQL-anything; that
way no one can have certifications unless they're under contract with
us! Better yet, they have to pay us royalties for using the
PostgreSQL name and providing downloads of the software.
It isn't April Fools again, is it? Because I don't know where you've
been living, but in most parts of the world, companies are free to do
pretty much whatever they want.
Frankly, certification is a business venture and not something an open
source project should get into managing. I believe this was discussed
in the archives before.
Besides, it seems pretty "proprietary" to limit certification to the
project itself doesn't it??? I was pretty sure this was "open"
source.
Oh well, I'm done laughing now.
--
Jonah H. Harris, Database Internals Architect
EnterpriseDB Corporation
732.331.1324
---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
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On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote: > Marc already did. I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was making a point of absurdity. -- Jonah H. Harris, Database Internals Architect EnterpriseDB Corporation 732.331.1324
On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote:
> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote:
> > Marc already did.
>
> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was
> making a point of absurdity.
>
That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become the
defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than allowing
the established postgresql community to have some influence over things?
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
-----Original Message----- From: "Jonah H. Harris"<jonah.harris@gmail.com> Sent: 17/04/06 13:36:03 To: "Dave Page"<dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> Cc: "luckysharma@gmail.com"<luckysharma@gmail.com>, "pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org"<pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org> Subject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] Postgresql Certifications. On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote: > Marc already did. > I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was > making a point of absurdity. Yeah, I know. Just couldn't think of a suitably witty acknowledgement :-( /D -----Unmodified Original Message----- On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote: > Marc already did. I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was making a point of absurdity. -- Jonah H. Harris, Database Internals Architect EnterpriseDB Corporation 732.331.1324
On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: > On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote: >> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote: >>> Marc already did. >> >> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was >> making a point of absurdity. >> > > That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become the > defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than allowing > the established postgresql community to have some influence over things? Hasn't SRA been offering certification for awhile now? ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664
Rajesh Sharma wrote: > I think certifications should be strictly under our community > control, rather than some other vendor issuing Postgresql certified > profressionals certificates. As long as their program is not set up in a way that deceives people into believing that the PostgreSQL community or some such endorses or conducts the program, I don't see anything that you can do about it. They are not the only company doing PostgreSQL certifications, FWIW. -- Peter Eisentraut http://developer.postgresql.org/~petere/
On Monday 17 April 2006 12:22, Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote:
> > On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote:
> >> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote:
> >>> Marc already did.
> >>
> >> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was
> >> making a point of absurdity.
> >
> > That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become
> > the defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than
> > allowing the established postgresql community to have some influence over
> > things?
>
> Hasn't SRA been offering certification for awhile now?
>
Yes (I happen to be a SRA PostgreSQL Certified Engineer, and encourage others
to get certified) but (taking Jonah's absurd postulate to the other extreme)
if micrsoft were to desire it, they could easily start up thier own
certification for postgresql and probably fairly quickly have numbers over
SRA.
While i don't believe that will happen, there are some scenarios floating
around about them doing a msose (microsoft open source engineer) where people
would certify knowledge of key components of open source software running on
windows platforms or interacting with windows products (think setting up an
open source mail system with exchange at the heart of it). PostgreSQL comes
into this picture generally as a way to combat mysql from eating up the low
end market that sql server used to own. It could lead to some form of
embracing and extending of postgresql tied back into thier certification; we
wouldn't be the first bsd licensed application that they have gotten involved
with.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: > On Monday 17 April 2006 12:22, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >> On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: >>> On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote: >>>> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote: >>>>> Marc already did. >>>> >>>> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was >>>> making a point of absurdity. >>> >>> That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become >>> the defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than >>> allowing the established postgresql community to have some influence over >>> things? >> >> Hasn't SRA been offering certification for awhile now? >> > > Yes (I happen to be a SRA PostgreSQL Certified Engineer, and encourage others > to get certified) but (taking Jonah's absurd postulate to the other extreme) > if micrsoft were to desire it, they could easily start up thier own > certification for postgresql and probably fairly quickly have numbers over > SRA. > > While i don't believe that will happen, there are some scenarios floating > around about them doing a msose (microsoft open source engineer) where people > would certify knowledge of key components of open source software running on > windows platforms or interacting with windows products (think setting up an > open source mail system with exchange at the heart of it). PostgreSQL comes > into this picture generally as a way to combat mysql from eating up the low > end market that sql server used to own. It could lead to some form of > embracing and extending of postgresql tied back into thier certification; we > wouldn't be the first bsd licensed application that they have gotten involved > with. 'k, and this is a bad thing because ... ? ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664
On Monday 17 April 2006 13:44, Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote:
> > On Monday 17 April 2006 12:22, Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> >> On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote:
> >>> On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote:
> >>>> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote:
> >>>>> Marc already did.
> >>>>
> >>>> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was
> >>>> making a point of absurdity.
> >>>
> >>> That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become
> >>> the defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than
> >>> allowing the established postgresql community to have some influence
> >>> over things?
> >>
> >> Hasn't SRA been offering certification for awhile now?
> >
> > Yes (I happen to be a SRA PostgreSQL Certified Engineer, and encourage
> > others to get certified) but (taking Jonah's absurd postulate to the
> > other extreme) if micrsoft were to desire it, they could easily start up
> > thier own certification for postgresql and probably fairly quickly have
> > numbers over SRA.
> >
> > While i don't believe that will happen, there are some scenarios floating
> > around about them doing a msose (microsoft open source engineer) where
> > people would certify knowledge of key components of open source software
> > running on windows platforms or interacting with windows products (think
> > setting up an open source mail system with exchange at the heart of it).
> > PostgreSQL comes into this picture generally as a way to combat mysql
> > from eating up the low end market that sql server used to own. It could
> > lead to some form of embracing and extending of postgresql tied back into
> > thier certification; we wouldn't be the first bsd licensed application
> > that they have gotten involved with.
>
> 'k, and this is a bad thing because ... ?
>
I might be a great thing. OTOH it could turn into a total cluster like the
whole Microsfot/Sun Java debacle. Having some measure of control over what
is deemed to be "postgresql-whatever" is not inherently bad.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: > I might be a great thing. OTOH it could turn into a total cluster like > the whole Microsfot/Sun Java debacle. Having some measure of control > over what is deemed to be "postgresql-whatever" is not inherently bad. So, what *should* happen instead of trying to say how can offer, there should be a list maintained on *our* web site for those that are considered "Community Approved" ... or, better, "Community Recommended" ... ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664
Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: >> On Monday 17 April 2006 12:22, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >> >> ...(microsoft open source engineer)... > > 'k, and this is a bad thing because ... ? I think it could be a very good thing for the project. I've seen some technology managers suggest that it could be better to use Oracle and MySQL because it's easier to find trained engineers with those backgrounds. If every company out there started selling PostgreSQL certifications (say, for $5 and a web-form) it'd quickly look to hiring managers that PostgreSQL was a more popular platform than MySQL. For the clueless managers who care about such things, it would hardly matter that most of those certifications don't mean much; and for the managers who did care, hopefully they'd either know which certifications to trust (I hear the SRA one is a very good one) or ask their own interview questions.
On Mon, 2006-04-17 at 15:35 -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote: > > > I might be a great thing. OTOH it could turn into a total cluster like > > the whole Microsfot/Sun Java debacle. Having some measure of control > > over what is deemed to be "postgresql-whatever" is not inherently bad. > > So, what *should* happen instead of trying to say how can offer, there > should be a list maintained on *our* web site for those that are > considered "Community Approved" ... or, better, "Community Recommended" I think the community, unless it is going to develop a community certification should stay out of it. Joshua D. Drake > ... > > ---- > Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) > Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664 > > ---------------------------(end of broadcast)--------------------------- > TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? > > http://archives.postgresql.org > -- === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. === Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240 Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997 http://www.commandprompt.com/
Robert,
Thanks, A few months ago we offered * free * vouchers to the community to take the certification test and by a overwhelming margin
all who took the exam said it was a very good exam.
Rich
**************************************************************
Richard T. Romanik
Vice President, Sales
SRA AMERICA (Formerly of One WTC)
PostgreSQL Services: Consulting, Migration, Support and Training
One Penn Plaza, Suite 1910
New York, NY 10119
Tel: 212.244.8833.52
Cell: 917.365.8700
www.sraapowergres.com rich@sraapowergres.com
www.sraoss.com
www.sraamerica.com
**************************************************************
----- Original Message -----From: Robert TreatTo: Marc G. FournierSent: Monday, April 17, 2006 1:27 PMSubject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] Postgresql Certifications.On Monday 17 April 2006 12:22, Marc G. Fournier wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Apr 2006, Robert Treat wrote:
> > On Monday 17 April 2006 08:36, Jonah H. Harris wrote:
> >> On 4/17/06, Dave Page <dpage@vale-housing.co.uk> wrote:
> >>> Marc already did.
> >>
> >> I admit, registering the trademark is valid for legal reasons. I was
> >> making a point of absurdity.
> >
> > That is is better to allow companies like microsoft or mysql to become
> > the defacto oraganization for getting "postgresql-anything" rather than
> > allowing the established postgresql community to have some influence over
> > things?
>
> Hasn't SRA been offering certification for awhile now?
>
Yes (I happen to be a SRA PostgreSQL Certified Engineer, and encourage others
to get certified) but (taking Jonah's absurd postulate to the other extreme)
if micrsoft were to desire it, they could easily start up thier own
certification for postgresql and probably fairly quickly have numbers over
SRA.
While i don't believe that will happen, there are some scenarios floating
around about them doing a msose (microsoft open source engineer) where people
would certify knowledge of key components of open source software running on
windows platforms or interacting with windows products (think setting up an
open source mail system with exchange at the heart of it). PostgreSQL comes
into this picture generally as a way to combat mysql from eating up the low
end market that sql server used to own. It could lead to some form of
embracing and extending of postgresql tied back into thier certification; we
wouldn't be the first bsd licensed application that they have gotten involved
with.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter Lamp :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
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