Thread: postgres win32 in FAT32
Hi, is it possible to install postgres win version on fat32? On 8.0 beta2 it told me I can only install it on ntfs. Thats fine for a server and no problem. But to give it to normal users it is bad. Cause many will have fat32 and not be able to change partition to ntfs. Any help and info is welcome. ALBI...
> Hi, > > is it possible to install postgres win version on fat32? > On 8.0 beta2 it told me I can only install it on ntfs. Thats > fine for a server and no problem. But to give it to normal > users it is bad. Cause many will have fat32 and not be able > to change partition to ntfs. > Any help and info is welcome. You can do it, though you are strongly advised not to do it. Features like tablespace will not work on FAT, and data integrity cannot be guaranteed in case of a crash. The installer will not let you initdb on it. You can, however, install without initdb:ing and then run initdb manually. Or you can install from source. IIRC. //Magnus
Magnus Hagander wrote: >>Hi, >> >>is it possible to install postgres win version on fat32? >>On 8.0 beta2 it told me I can only install it on ntfs. Thats >>fine for a server and no problem. But to give it to normal >>users it is bad. Cause many will have fat32 and not be able >>to change partition to ntfs. >>Any help and info is welcome. >> >> > >You can do it, though you are strongly advised not to do it. Features >like tablespace will not work on FAT, and data integrity cannot be >guaranteed in case of a crash. > >The installer will not let you initdb on it. You can, however, install >without initdb:ing and then run initdb manually. Or you can install from >source. IIRC. > > Also, AFAIK every windows system we support has NTFS. We don't at all support the older "consumer" systems that were FAT or FAT32 only, like W95, W98 and WMe, nor do we support NT < 4/SP3 IIRC. cheers andrew
On Thu, 7 Oct 2004, Andrew Dunstan wrote: > Also, AFAIK every windows system we support has NTFS. We don't at all > support the older "consumer" systems that were FAT or FAT32 only, like > W95, W98 and WMe, nor do we support NT < 4/SP3 IIRC. Sometimes the systems could have been upgraded from previous O.S. and retained the FAT32 filesystem. Other possibilities are secondary storage (like firewire drives) that may have been formatted non-NTFS.
Hello everyone: My $0.02: Don't bother supporting FAT at all. I believe anywone who wants to install PostgreSQL on NT5+ would either have an NTFS partition, or be able to create/convert one easily. From http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/maintain/convertfat.ms px: (first page on google for "convert fat ntfs") > Converting to NTFS Using Convert.exe > > A partition can also be converted after Setup by using Convert.exe. > For more information about Convert.exe, after completing Setup, click > Start, click Run, type cmd, and then press ENTER. In the command > window, type help convert, and then press ENTER. Christian Holteng.
Hi, I do not agree to this :-) We like to give away some software on CD and for that we like to use some db, postgres would be fine. We know that it will only run on w2k and XP (and that is ok), but many home user installations still have FAT32 partitions. Everthing runs on FAT32, but postgres not. And for shure most home users will not know how to convert fat32 to ntfs nor do that, cause they see no reason. And I'm surprised that some functions will not work in postgres on fat32. What is the reason? I know fat32 is less security and on real servers I will always use ntfs, but for this cd software I can not say, yuo must use ntfs :-( ALBI... Mooshii schrieb: > Hello everyone: > > My $0.02: Don't bother supporting FAT at all. > I believe anywone who wants to install PostgreSQL on NT5+ would either have > an NTFS partition, or be able to create/convert one easily. > > From > http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/maintain/convertfat.ms > px: > (first page on google for "convert fat ntfs") > >>Converting to NTFS Using Convert.exe >> >>A partition can also be converted after Setup by using Convert.exe. >>For more information about Convert.exe, after completing Setup, click >>Start, click Run, type cmd, and then press ENTER. In the command >>window, type help convert, and then press ENTER. > > > > Christian Holteng. > > > > ---------------------------(end of broadcast)--------------------------- > TIP 8: explain analyze is your friend >
>We like to give away some software on CD and for that we like to use >some db, postgres would be fine. We know that it will only run on w2k >and XP (and that is ok), but many home user installations still have >FAT32 partitions. Everthing runs on FAT32, but postgres not. And for >shure most home users will not know how to convert fat32 to >ntfs nor do >that, cause they see no reason. >And I'm surprised that some functions will not work in postgres on >fat32. What is the reason? >I know fat32 is less security and on real servers I will always use >ntfs, but for this cd software I can not say, yuo must use ntfs :-( Specifically, FAT32 does not support Directory Junctions, which means tablespaces don't work. That's the only filesystem specific function that is used directly. (security and reliability are of course used indirectly) That said, you *can* run pg on FAT32, it's just not recommended. The installer won't let you. But if you install just the files (you can do this from the installer, just don't enable service or initdb) and run it manually, it should work. Beware that no testing is done on FAT. And don't expect your data to be around if the machine crashes. Right now I think only tablespaces won't work, but if other features don't work, don't expect anybody to put down a lot of effort to make a workaround for FAT. //Magnus
Hi, On Sunday 17 October 2004 18:37, you wrote: > >We like to give away some software on CD and for that we like to use > >some db, postgres would be fine. We know that it will only run on w2k > >and XP (and that is ok), but many home user installations still have > >FAT32 partitions. Everthing runs on FAT32, but postgres not. And for > >shure most home users will not know how to convert fat32 to > >ntfs nor do > >that, cause they see no reason. > >And I'm surprised that some functions will not work in postgres on > >fat32. What is the reason? > >I know fat32 is less security and on real servers I will always use > >ntfs, but for this cd software I can not say, yuo must use ntfs :-( > > Specifically, FAT32 does not support Directory Junctions, which means > tablespaces don't work. That's the only filesystem specific function > that is used directly. (security and reliability are of course used > indirectly) > > That said, you *can* run pg on FAT32, it's just not recommended. The > installer won't let you. But if you install just the files (you can do > this from the installer, just don't enable service or initdb) and run it > manually, it should work. > > Beware that no testing is done on FAT. And don't expect your data to be > around if the machine crashes. Right now I think only tablespaces won't > work, but if other features don't work, don't expect anybody to put down > a lot of effort to make a workaround for FAT. > > //Magnus OK, we understand that part of FAT32 not being reliable enough - but shouldn't that choice being made by the admin, not the installer? The rationale is clear, but sometimes people just have to use FAT32 (like in the cited case on top of this message), and can't do anything about it. An installer which works, but refuses to initdb is, er, not helpful. This whole 'FAT32 is bad, so we refuse it' issue seems like going too far - the admin is responsible for making sure the system is reliable enough. Nobody would place mission critical data on FAT32 anyway, if he's aware. If not, the data is not mission critical or someone would have taught this person or shot him. Please, don't treat PostgreSQL users like children - most of them know what they're doing, even on WIN32! If the data is not so critical, then refusing to initdb is a burden on those people who want to use PG in their applications or _demos_ of applications, beacuse installation gets hard to the point of being unuseable by the end user. It's a bit like the 'psql can't be run by Administrator issue', but this is already covered nicely by the installer creating the service account. Can't the FAT issue be dealt with similarly? Just pop up a warning dialog, saying something like Placing database data files on a FAT file system is not recommended because of possible data corruption. If possible, convert this filesystem to NTFS or use another drive. Conversion can be done using convert. Please look up convert in the windows help. This would have the additional benefit of making users aware. Greetings, Jörg -- Leading SW developer - S.E.A GmbH Mail: joerg.hessdoerfer@sea-gmbh.com WWW: http://www.sea-gmbh.com
> > Specifically, FAT32 does not support Directory Junctions, > which means > > tablespaces don't work. That's the only filesystem specific > function > > that is used directly. (security and reliability are of course used > > indirectly) > > > > That said, you *can* run pg on FAT32, it's just not > recommended. The > > installer won't let you. But if you install just the files > (you can do > > this from the installer, just don't enable service or > initdb) and run > > it manually, it should work. > > > > Beware that no testing is done on FAT. And don't expect > your data to > > be around if the machine crashes. Right now I think only > tablespaces > > won't work, but if other features don't work, don't expect > anybody to > > put down a lot of effort to make a workaround for FAT. > > > > //Magnus > > OK, we understand that part of FAT32 not being reliable > enough - but shouldn't that choice being made by the admin, > not the installer? The rationale is clear, but sometimes > people just have to use FAT32 (like in the cited case on top > of this message), and can't do anything about it. An > installer which works, but refuses to initdb is, er, not helpful. > This whole 'FAT32 is bad, so we refuse it' issue seems like > going too far - the admin is responsible for making sure the > system is reliable enough. There are other reasons for the installer not to do it as well. The installer sets permissions and does several verifications on the selected directories. All these operations fail miserably on FAT. Workarounds could certainly be made, but it's not something that'll be done until all other parts are finished. > It's a bit like the 'psql can't be run by Administrator > issue', but this is already covered nicely by the installer > creating the service account. Can't the FAT issue be dealt > with similarly? To do that similarly, that would mean automatically converting the filesystem. I doubt that's a good idea. > Just pop up a warning dialog, saying something like > > Placing database data files on a FAT file system is not > recommended because of possible data corruption. If possible, > convert this filesystem to NTFS or use another drive. > Conversion can be done using convert. Please look up convert > in the windows help. > > This would have the additional benefit of making users aware. Something like this would be how to put in the workaround eventually, yes. //Magnus