Thread: Time to dust off your Ingres migration skills
For those of you who work for PostgreSQL consulting companies, you're about to develop a lucrative line in converting formerIngres users: http://www.dbms2.com/2011/09/25/ingres-actian/ PostgreSQL is starting to look scarily like "last open source relational database standing". -- Josh Berkus PostgreSQL Experts Inc. http://pgexperts.com San Francisco
Joshua Berkus wrote: > For those of you who work for PostgreSQL consulting companies, you're about to develop a lucrative line in converting formerIngres users: > > http://www.dbms2.com/2011/09/25/ingres-actian/ > > PostgreSQL is starting to look scarily like "last open source relational database standing". Oh please. I am a yarn-dyed Ingres bigot I know, but Curt is a rent-seeking sack of do-do. Is it unfair to ask if his business practices remind one of a protection racket? Pay him a fat fee to speak kindly of your company or he will take the time to speak unkindly of it?) My contacts tell me he has previously approached Ingres Corp (now Actian Corp) for a fee and been sent packing. Aligning yourself with comments from Monash reflects poorly on you. Furthermore, I was talking to Steve Shine yesterday (CEO of Actian) and he assures me that Greg Woods was misquoted in that article. Ingres and Vectorwise are being energetically developed. It's no secret that the Ingres geospatial project is going to be released this year for instance. Vectorwise is rapidly adding functionality too. Both are doing great, commercially and technically. Especially commercially. I will admit that open source Ingres had a lot of catching up to do after being released from the cryogenic embrace of Computer Associates, but the work is coming along. In spite of being an Ingres bigot I have huge respect for PostgreSQL, and I wouldn't think of targetting PostgreSQL users for migration. There's plenty of rubbish products out there for us both to work at displacing. -- Roy UK Ingres User Association Conference 2012 will be on Tuesday June 19 2012. *NOTE THE CHANGED DATE* See www.uk-iua.org.uk
> I am a yarn-dyed Ingres bigot I know, but Curt is a rent-seeking sack > of do-do. Is it unfair to ask if his business practices remind > one of a protection racket? Pay him a fat fee to speak kindly of > your > company or he will take the time to speak unkindly of it?) My > contacts > tell me he has previously approached Ingres Corp (now Actian Corp) > for > a fee and been sent packing. > > Aligning yourself with comments from Monash reflects poorly on you. I wasn't familiar with Mr. Monash before. My apologies for linking to him, then! Note that the rename of the company and the "new direction" has been similarly received by other news sources. And by customers;the way I found out about it is that a company called me about migration to Postgres from Ingres and sent me thelink as why they were looking into it. If I were an Ingres geek, I'd be looking hard at establishing a developer community outside of Actian corp. Let me knowif you want to set up a fund with SPI! --Josh Berkus
On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 6:35 PM, Joshua Berkus <josh@agliodbs.com> wrote: > >> I am a yarn-dyed Ingres bigot I know, but Curt is a rent-seeking sack >> of do-do. Is it unfair to ask if his business practices remind >> one of a protection racket? Pay him a fat fee to speak kindly of >> your >> company or he will take the time to speak unkindly of it?) My >> contacts tell me he has previously approached Ingres Corp (now Actian Corp) >> for a fee and been sent packing. >> >> Aligning yourself with comments from Monash reflects poorly on you. > > I wasn't familiar with Mr. Monash before. My apologies for linking to him, then! What?!? I'm not sure any facts about Curt Monash have been established here, nor am I interested in seeing such debate here since it is clearly OT for this list, which concerns the efforts of people trying to generate *positive* support for the *PostgreSQL* database system. All we know for sure is that Roy Hann has made what are clearly unacceptable personal comments on our list and should be censured and possibly banned, not offered apologies, assistance and agreement from core team members who should know better. -- Simon Riggs http://www.2ndQuadrant.com/ PostgreSQL Development, 24x7 Support, Training & Services
Joshua Berkus wrote: >> Aligning yourself with comments from Monash reflects poorly on you. > > I wasn't familiar with Mr. Monash before. My apologies for linking to > him, then! You will have seen Simon Riggs comments on this. > Note that the rename of the company and the "new direction" has been > similarly received by other news sources. Most that I've seen have been fairly neutral reports of fact. None that I've seen have riffed on it much. > And by customers; the way I > found out about it is that a company called me about migration to > Postgres from Ingres and sent me the link as why they were looking into > it. Oh dear. One would hope that as a matter due diligence they'd check with the company or the user groups to see if any of his claims hold up. They don't. New development continues apace; new customers are signing up, and revenue is way up. All that has happened is the marketing team has chosen a new focus. As you noted yourself recently, getting media attention for a DBMS is a tough job. So they've looked for another door to push on. Good for them. If anything, a new product line that utterly depends on the core products should reassure everyone that the core products are still core! > If I were an Ingres geek, I'd be looking hard at establishing a > developer community outside of Actian corp. Let me know if you want to > set up a fund with SPI! I think we'd better wait until I'm "rehabilitated" here before pursuing that, but the kindness of your offer is noted. -- Roy UK Ingres User Association Conference 2012 will be on Tuesday June 19 2012. *NOTE THE CHANGED DATE* See www.uk-iua.org.uk
Simon Riggs wrote: > On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 6:35 PM, Joshua Berkus <josh@agliodbs.com> wrote: >> >>> I am a yarn-dyed Ingres bigot I know, but Curt is a rent-seeking sack >>> of do-do. Is it unfair to ask if his business practices remind >>> one of a protection racket? Pay him a fat fee to speak kindly of >>> your >>> company or he will take the time to speak unkindly of it?) My >>> contacts tell me he has previously approached Ingres Corp (now Actian Corp) >>> for a fee and been sent packing. >>> >>> Aligning yourself with comments from Monash reflects poorly on you. >> >> I wasn't familiar with Mr. Monash before. My apologies for linking to him, then! > > What?!? I'm not sure any facts about Curt Monash have been established > here, nor am I interested in seeing such debate here since it is > clearly OT for this list, which concerns the efforts of people trying > to generate *positive* support for the *PostgreSQL* database system. Indeed. > All we know for sure is that Roy Hann has made what are clearly > unacceptable personal comments on our list and should be censured and > possibly banned, not offered apologies, assistance and agreement from > core team members who should know better. I consider myself duly censured. It wasn't actually necessary for you to know why I find Curt Monash an unsuitable inspiration, only that I do. Having said that, I will assert that his article is not objective and certainly wasn't intended to benefit the company or products in question. Just why Monash would take the time to write such a thing is, I think, open to a range of searching questions. I will not back down over my claim that implicitly endorsing his attack by referring to it and enlarging on it reflects badly on this community. You don't need to do that; there are any number of good technical reasons to suggest adopting PostgreSQL without bashing another excellent product. None of us come out this exchange looking our best. I apologize for my part in it, and whether Joshua owes the Ingres community an apology or not, I am delighted that he seems willing take a more objective view of Monash. Now, please do get back to *positively* promoting PostgreSQL. There is work to be done by all of us. -- Roy UK Ingres User Association Conference 2012 will be on Tuesday June 19 2012. *NOTE THE CHANGED DATE* See www.uk-iua.org.uk