Re: Postgresql + containerization possible use case - Mailing list pgsql-general
| From | Rainer Duffner |
|---|---|
| Subject | Re: Postgresql + containerization possible use case |
| Date | |
| Msg-id | B155E3AD-0CF6-48E6-AD7F-30D67EA8FED8@ultra-secure.de Whole thread Raw |
| In response to | Re: Postgresql + containerization possible use case (Achilleas Mantzios <achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com>) |
| Responses |
Re: Postgresql + containerization possible use case
(Achilleas Mantzios <achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com>)
|
| List | pgsql-general |
Am 13.12.2021 um 12:41 schrieb Achilleas Mantzios <achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com>:Our setup has been open source since forever. So licenses for something that used to be free for ages would be hard to introduce.
That ist totally understandable.
140x800 for the RHEL license alone is over 100k/year.
Though you might get a volume discount at that point ;-)
So Docker is NOT free? Please share your thoughts? I am a complete noob.
The commercial version is not free.
The „CE“ version is free, but I’m not sure how stable the API is.
Dockerhub, for what it’s worth, isn’t completely free anymore either.
Those servers I am talking about have no internet connectivity. And the satellite connection costs are high.
(although I think we pay a fixed amount for a certain total data transfer size).
Yes. That’s why using a more offline-friendly infrastructure might make more sense.
RHEL seems to be pretty well tuned running in high-secure air-gapped networks - which is what a ship basically is.
Those servers live for years, the objective is to facilitate upgrades.The question is: do you want to get there?But maybe your developers want to get here, because they don’t want to learn about software-packaging (anymore) - but is that what the business wants?
Yes, but docker-upgrades aren’t free either.
At least, I cannot imagine running such an infrastructure in the gung-ho style that a typical developer runs his docker-containers.
You’d want to run a tight ship with those ;-)
You will need a lot more tooling around this (continuous integration, continuous deployment) - which is the reason I suggested moving all this infrastructure to the ship itself. If you produce and mirror the artifacts locally, you should have less backhaul traffic (which is what I assume is killing you with sat-com - downstream can probably be had cheap-ish these days - or pretty soon via the likes of StarLink)
Thanks for the link, I didn't quite understand what they do with docker (video included).
It’s passenger entertainment and engagement, from what I can see.
It’s sad and funny to read, as shortly after that huge cruises got out of fashion ;-)
It’s also not mission-critical.
120 docker containers in two data centers on the ship? Ours will be just a single linux box with limited connectivity (in some seas no connectivity ) to the internet/shore.
Yes, and this is IMO where you will have to get management on board to upgrade infrastructure and tooling around docker containers (and likely Kubernetes) - if your developers persist on using it that way.
You will end up running a small server-cluster on each ship - I would guess there are specialized vendors who produce sea-worthy server-equipment.
(That was pre-pandemic…)I would make an educated guess that you’d need to have the whole docker-infrastructure on each ship (build-server, repository etc.pp.) to minimize sat-com traffic.
Hmm, I don't know about that. The hardware is given (existing) and limited.
You are like the 2nd person who warned about comms as being an issue with docker/containers.
Can't someone have a free docker system inside a linux server and run the containers (free again) until he/she decides to upgrade either docker or (more frequently) one of the images?
Is Docker upwards compatible? Meaning new Docker versions to run old images ?
Yes, likely. But upgrading docker itself sometimes comes with its own challenges.
As you said, all these servers are with limited connectivity and no local help available...
Again, I’m the last person you want to ask how docker actually works (but often, the developers themselves don’t know either, but they know which commands to feed it…)
Also, most of my knowledge of ships is from watching NCIS (and reading Clive Cussler novels...).
Can you please explain in more detail?I mean, it looks like it could be done. But this is where the „dev“ part in the „devops" world has to take a step back and the „ops“ guys need to come forward.
With 140-ish servers air-gapped on vessels around the world, this is IMO a serious operations-problem and needs to be handled properly, with an air-tight (or water-tight…) operational concept.
Your infrastructure has outgrown its original design limits. Time to talk to management about upping the game (and the budget).
Best Regards
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